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OT: METS STARTING PITCHING

SnakeTom

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May 29, 2001
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THE SCARIEST THING about the youthful Mets pitchers is this: Everyone knows how good Matt Harvey is, but right now Harvey is only the 3rd best starter on the METS behind DeGrom and THOR (Synagaard). Unfortunately for the Mets the Pitchers are also the best hitters on the team. It's hard to win consistently when you offense only puts up about 2 runs per game.

TK
 
Two runs held up tonight as Synagaard was near perfection in his shutout. But speaking of the Mets can anyone possibly be as dumb as Jerrys Mejia..
 
Perhaps, A-Rod. (His extraordinary season is a big surprise. Maybe a bigger one than we thought! lol)
 
Why spread gossip on a man making a comeback? How much money does he lose if he gets caught? I applaud a rod till I have reason to think he is cheating. Fitness and diet are so much more informed now. Guys will play longer and all time greats will play great longer.

Tom, I remember the great dodger staffs. And the Orioles with 4 20 game winners. But the Mets pitchers are amazing. Each start is an event. Imo, if duda and granderson finish the season hitting, they may have enough to make the playoffs and if they make it, no one wants to play them.
 
It's one thing to do something that harms the integrity of the game and then get caught. It's another to be so bold and lie through your teeth and even falsely accuse others like A-Rod, Clemens, Lance Johnson and Pete Rose have done. I'm a Yankee fan, but not much of an A-Rod fan at all because of that. Meija? He's an idiot.
 
People can turn a corner and Arod certainly has proven he has the talent. Why not hope he is clean and is making a terrific comeback? I am giving him a break and rooting for him till I have reason to doubt. And if people think he is still cheating but just not getting caught, the only logical corollary is that the league is still dirty as hell. What is left on his guaranteed contract? 75 mill? 125 mill. That is a helluva gamble with guaranteed money.

But the Mets starters are great. I dare say the best young staff I HAVE EVER SEEN. The Mets had these five young arms, and brought them up, and each one has shown to be special. Hopefully Wheeler can make the comeback like Harvey did.
 
People can turn a corner and Arod certainly has proven he has the talent. Why not hope he is clean and is making a terrific comeback? I am giving him a break and rooting for him till I have reason to doubt. And if people think he is still cheating but just not getting caught, the only logical corollary is that the league is still dirty as hell. What is left on his guaranteed contract? 75 mill? 125 mill. That is a helluva gamble with guaranteed money.

But the Mets starters are great. I dare say the best young staff I HAVE EVER SEEN. The Mets had these five young arms, and brought them up, and each one has shown to be special. Hopefully Wheeler can make the comeback like Harvey did.
I don't think A-Rod is cheating for the reasons you mentioned. I think his integrity sucks and I find it difficult to root for him. I don't think a lot of someone that falsely attacks others to cover up his own lies. I draw the difference with someone like Andy Petit. He screwed up, but admitted it and took personal responsibility. I've never heard A-Rod do any of that.
 
Seton75, You make excellent points. Gossip is wrong, but public figures, even in sports, do deserve greater scrutiny than the ordinary joe. Also, A-Rod was cheating at a fairly sophisticated level and working with doctors who could provide PED's that were undetectable.
 
THE SCARIEST THING about the youthful Mets pitchers is this: Everyone knows how good Matt Harvey is, but right now Harvey is only the 3rd best starter on the METS behind DeGrom and THOR (Synagaard). Unfortunately for the Mets the Pitchers are also the best hitters on the team. It's hard to win consistently when you offense only puts up about 2 runs per game.

TK
I am a Yankee fan, but I have to tell you, I find myself following the Mets even more than the (surprising) Yanks this season. Their starting rotation is unbelievable....they need to loosen the purse strings a bit and get at least one solid bat for that lineup. Dont waste this opportunity.

Think about this...how do you line up that staff for a short, playoff series? I know I wouldnt want to face them...
 
A Rod isnt clean and neither is basically 100% of everyone else. So its really no big deal.
 
A Rod isnt clean and neither is basically 100% of everyone else. So its really no big deal.

Steroid use is rampant in professional sports. Testing technology and costs are way behind the types of steroids taken by top professional athletes. A sophisticated athlete and his team of consultants can easily avoid positive tests. Positive tests come about only because of poor timing and using the wrong type of steroids. The only reason certain high profile baseball players, including A Rod, were caught was because of the Balco investigation. There was also some shenanigans and bias regarding the players who identities were "leaked out" in the investigation by MLB. Most of the high profile stars didn't have to lie to cover up their usage. You can bet, however, that a lot of them were using steroids. Singling out A Rod is therefore really unfair. MLB is being very hypocritical in singling out a player such as A Rod. However, A Rod and the MLB players' Union are smart enough to realize that the condemnation of steroids is a public relations ploy by MLB and therefore they are willing to take a hit for the sake of television and advertisement revenues.
 
I'm convinced that about 80% or so were using PED's prior to the testing & many are probably still users, but if that is so how does one explain the big drop on HR's hit today as opposed to 10 years ago.

Tom K,
 
Just a guess on my part, Tom. Maybe it's because more pitchers are using steroids now?
 
A-Rod was singled out but he handled it poorly and made MLB look better than they should have.
 
This Mets staff is must-see type of stuff. Exciting group... Even as a NYY fan.

But they're going to have to do something with the depth of it to get some position players in there or else they're going to waste those arms and leave them disgruntled.

Uribe and Johnson are improvements but they need an impact hitter desperately.
 
A-Rod was singled out but he handled it poorly and made MLB look better than they should have.

I agree with this. His whole persona made him an easy target and given his productivity he was Selig's Moby Dick on the entire issue.

A-Rod did himself zero favors. But I will say he finally seems humble and at ease this season. The Yankees have become an exciting team lately and the feelings towards him from his teammates look genuine, too. Totally different.
 
Next year potential staff of deGrom, Harvey, Syndergaard, Matz, and Wheeler. Scary. The question will be whether you trade one of these guys for a big time slugger in the offseason.
 
This Mets staff is must-see type of stuff. Exciting group... Even as a NYY fan.

But they're going to have to do something with the depth of it to get some position players in there or else they're going to waste those arms and leave them disgruntled.

Uribe and Johnson are improvements but they need an impact hitter desperately.
Obviously, their offense is not great. They don't have a hitter who you can depend on for big numbers. They have just gone through a hitting slump as well and it isn't clear to me if the slump was a slump or closer to what to expect. But Duda and Granderson have been hitting (GG has been for a while). Both will probably hit in the low 20s for HRs at worst. Murphy is a good hitter. Flores is a decent hitter for a second baseman. If the catcher comes back, he can hit too. Tejada is actually having a way better season that one would expect. They get nothing from two OF slots and that is the killer. If they can make a trade for a decent OF, I think they have enough to support these pitchers. The lack of production from the guy in LF has been a real killer. And most expected Lagares to build on last year but not happening.
 
Mets need one of these guys....Cespedes, Parra, Upton, Byrd, Gomez, or Bruce. Can't have Lagares/Neuwenheis playing everyday in a pennant race. Can Conforto play CF?
 
I'm not a Met fan but I give them a lot of credit for identifying and drafting or trading for the quality starting pitching that they have . If they don't get hurt they really could be something special.

With respect to their position players what I don't see is anyone who you could call a high quality professional hitter and until they add or develop a couple or three of that type of player their offense is going to struggle.
 
Wheeler and Flores to Brewers for Gomez according to joel Sherman
 
Wheeler and Flores to Brewers for Gomez according to joel Sherman

I don't get it. I was at Citifield for tonight's game. As word was spreading about the trade being a done deal we could not figure out why Flores was still in the game and not being pulled. I even wondered if Flores knew why he was getting a standing ovation when he batted in the 8th inning. Turns out there was no deal. the press was getting ahead of itself. Issues developed on both Wheeler's and Gomez health.

Tom K
 
Has to be more about Gomez than Wheeler. I mean I think it's pretty obvious that Zach is hurt
 
I think the Brewers GM got some shit for taking the risk and is balking.
 
Most recent reports say the Mets backed out after they saw Gomez medical reports on his hip. I guess that would explain why Carlos only has 7 SB this year rather than about 40 in previous years.

TK
 
Conflicting stories from both sides now. Just a strange deal all around.

So, what really happened that led to the Mets calling off the deal? A source familiar with the talks on both sides said a series of events that were actually financial, not medical, were the key factors.

That source said in initial talks, the Mets wanted the Brewers to take centerfielder Juan Lagares in the trade. The Brewers said no, in part because Lagares has an elbow issue but also because he has a four-year, $23 million contract extension that kicks in next year and they didn't want to pick up the money.

So, after further talks, it was decided that the Brewers would take Flores in addition to Wheeler, who is recovering from Tommy John surgery and won't be able to pitch before next June. The source said the Mets then asked the Brewers to throw in the 2016 Competitive Balance Round B pick they were recently awarded and the Brewers said no.

The source said the Brewers then were asked to put some money in the trade to cover part of what's remaining on Gomez's contract, including a $9 million salary next year. Considering the talent level of Gomez and his reasonable contract, the Brewers understandably declined to put any cash into the deal.

It was only then, according to the source, that the Mets came back and said they were calling off the deal because of concerns over Gomez's medical records.

So, this became a financial issue in the end, which many people would say is not surprising considering the financial constraints the Mets have been operating under in recent years.

And I'm guessing the Brewers are none too thrilled about how this transpired, though the diplomatic Melvin would never say so.

http://www.jsonline.com/blogs/sports/320022541.html
 
In each bloggers desire to boast that they were the first to declare the trade a "DONE DEAL" they forgot one important thing. There never was a deal.

TK
 
What a horrible 24 hours for the Mets. What a blunder. Blowing a 7-1 lead and Gomez has now been traded to the Astro's who seem unconcerned about his health. Really looks like the Mets major concern was about money as usual.
 
What a horrible 24 hours for the Mets. What a blunder. Blowing a 7-1 lead and Gomez has now been traded to the Astro's who seem unconcerned about his health. Really looks like the Mets major concern was about money as usual.

Absolutely. IMO, they've always been run a bit shoddy during the Wilpon Era, but still never like what's gone on since the Madoff incident.

This team needs a shot in the arm. They need to energize things or its going to be a lost season.
 
And how about Kansas City (Cueto, Zobrist), Houston (Kazmir, Gomez), and Toronto (Tulowitzki and Price)?

Great stuff. Huge additions.
 
The Wilpons are a joke. I had a hunch that hip injury was bogus. He has missed 1 game in the last month. If the Mets can't afford Gomez's 9 mil for next season then sell the team. It's beyond pathetic now.
 
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And how about Kansas City (Cueto, Zobrist), Houston (Kazmir, Gomez), and Toronto (Tulowitzki and Price)?

Great stuff. Huge additions.
And Texas, got the best player in Cole Hamels without giving up their top prospect.
 
What a horrible 24 hours for the Mets. What a blunder. Blowing a 7-1 lead and Gomez has now been traded to the Astro's who seem unconcerned about his health. Really looks like the Mets major concern was about money as usual.

Still don't know if issue with Gomez was money or health, but the Mets rebounded by getting a better yet hitter and implausibly the almost traded Flores become the hero of the day just 48 hours later.

TK
 
Still don't know if issue with Gomez was money or health, but the Mets rebounded by getting a better yet hitter and implausibly the almost traded Flores become the hero of the day just 48 hours later.

TK
Great trade, prefer cespedes far more, but better game...storybook ending
 
Now you wonder why they'd give up Wheeler for Gomez anyway when they got Cespedes without giving up anyone! Probably due to Cespedes is a FA.

Great move for the Mets. And how about Flores last night. Wild!
 
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