ADVERTISEMENT

It's early but this is comical

The above has nothing to do with the Yankees. I was posting plus minus numbers that do not add up as the Marlins should be head and shoulders ahead of the rest of the teams, yet they are in last place. Thus my comment about not hitting in the clutch.
 
That's been a problem (early on) for SHU's baseball team.

Win the blowouts and lose the nailbiters.
 
Halldan1 said:
1 Philadelphia Phillies -14

2 New York Mets -11

3 Atlanta Braves -9

4 Washington Nationals -21

5 Miami Marlins +18

Someone's not hitting in the clutch!
Click to expand...
i mean theyre all not hitting in the clutch LOL. marlins the only team that has won big i guess. phillies dont hit in the clutch, they get runs early then routinely have it a 1 run game in the 9th. clockwork.


braves should be way better.
 
Does run differential really have much to do with hitting in the clutch?

To a small degree, yes, but you can’t ignore pitching and defense as factors that can outweigh it. For instance, the Mets lost a 14-4 game where the final runs were against a position player. If the Phillies bullpen stinks, does that ineptitude reflect on how the team hits?
 
lloyde dobler said:
Does run differential really have much to do with hitting in the clutch?

To a small degree, yes, but you can’t ignore pitching and defense as factors that can outweigh it. For instance, the Mets lost a 14-4 game where the final runs were against a position player. If the Phillies bullpen stinks, does that ineptitude reflect on how the team hits?
Click to expand...
no, but the phillies are also inept at hitting in the clutch. basically all their runs are first half of the game and they leave an insane amount of runners on base. its both haha. and theyre in 1st!
 
It's still a small sample size. Barely more than 20% of the season. A handful of games can skew the results as you see with the Marlins especially. It's like winning three basketball games by eight, 10 and 12 points each and losing by 35. You're 3-1 but your scoring margin is minus-5.

A few other tidbits. The Phillies are 16-15 and minus-14 in run differential. The Brewers are 17-14 and minus-4. The Dodgers are 17-15 and plus-37 (the highest in MLB).

Oakland is 19-13, the best record in MLB and they are minus-7. Seattle is 17-15 and minus-7 while Houston is 15-15 and plus-25. The Astros are the only plus team in the AL West.

The Yankees (16-14) and Tampa (17-15) are virtually tied in the AL East standings. The Yankees are plus-21 and the Rays minus-1.

Cleveland, Kansas City and the Chicago White Sox are all tied at 16-13 apiece. Chicago is plus-36, Cleveland is plus-7 and KC is minus-10.
 
Plus you have certain players that crush the 7th guy in the bullpen in non-competitive games but can’t hit the starter. They score 6-7 in the 8th inning in a game that’s already been decided.
 
  • Like
Reactions: lloyde dobler
Halldan1 said:
The above has nothing to do with the Yankees. I was posting plus minus numbers that do not add up as the Marlins should be head and shoulders ahead of the rest of the teams, yet they are in last place. Thus my comment about not hitting in the clutch.
Click to expand...

When it comes to Mets fans, it's always about the Yankees.
 
SHUSA said:
no, but the phillies are also inept at hitting in the clutch. basically all their runs are first half of the game and they leave an insane amount of runners on base. its both haha. and theyre in 1st!
Click to expand...
of course they make that comment look dumb today but tbf they didnt get any runs for the bullpen still
 
No, I started it about the Marlins.

My God, let it go. You're looking for something that isn't there.
 
It's not even about hitting in the clutch anymore, it's about lack of productive outs. I find myself watching the cardinals more than anyone these days. Yadier Molina is a true throw back. This past weekend I was watching the cardinals and in his first at bat back from injury 2nd and 3rd one out, he hits a ground ball with an exit velocity of maybe 50 mph to the 2nd baseman that gets the run in, advances the other runner to 3rd. Molina is actually clapping down the baseline because he knows he did his job and his teammates are all over him when he gets back to the dugout. That's baseball. Sad we don't see that from every team.
 
  • Like
Reactions: anon_ezos2e9wn1ob0, Seton75 and shu09
I get a Dodger blogger's emails a few times a week. In the one for today, he gives these NL batting average stats

2021, .234
1908, .239
1907, .243
1968, .243
1906, .244
1909, .244
1963, .245
1989, .246
2020, .246
1916, .247

Strikeouts per game

2021: 9.06
2019: 8.81
2018: 8.64
2020: 8.55
2017: 8.36
2016: 8.19
2014: 7.90
2015: 7.89
2012: 7.64
2013: 7.56

Brutal
 
  • Like
Reactions: lloyde dobler
The game is becoming unwatchable.

I know this is radical but they may have to move the mound back a little. Pitchers are now regularly hitting 97-100 MPH on the radar gun forcing batters to react sooner than ever.

And yeah, I know there are going to be complaints with the batters swinging for the fences regardless of the count. But even with that I think it's becoming incredibly difficult to just put good wood on the ball.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Seton75
MLB is testing moving the mound further back courtesy of the Atlantic League starting the 2nd half of the season. Should be interesting, but probably something that needs to be done. Games are becoming pretty unwatchable.
 
Halldan1 said:
The game is becoming unwatchable.

I know this is radical but they may have to move the mound back a little. Pitchers are now regularly hitting 97-100 MPH on the radar gun forcing batters to react sooner than ever.

And yeah, I know there are going to be complaints with the batters swinging for the fences regardless of the count. But even with that I think it's becoming incredibly difficult to just put good wood on the ball.
Click to expand...
well if they were swinging for contact theyd hit it more. pitchers got better, time for hitters to get better. what theyre doing isnt working. at least for watchability
 
Moving the mound back will create a ton of extra foul balls, which will prolong games and pitch counts. Plus it’s not the speed, but the combination of speed and nasty movement that prompts many strikeouts. Now pitchers will be able to move the ball more if given an extra foot.
 
lloyde dobler said:
Moving the mound back will create a ton of extra foul balls, which will prolong games and pitch counts. Plus it’s not the speed, but the combination of speed and nasty movement that prompts many strikeouts. Now pitchers will be able to move the ball more if given an extra foot.
Click to expand...
i mean i dont see how you can prove it would result in more foul balls. it would logically reault in more contact in general. hits and foul balls, and probably more hits.

unlessss the movement peice you mentioned is really a problem.
 
I don't see how anyone can watch professional sports anymore. Money grabs everywhere and boring products.
 
SHUSA said:
i mean i dont see how you can prove it would result in more foul balls. it would logically reault in more contact in general. hits and foul balls, and probably more hits.

unlessss the movement peice you mentioned is really a problem.
Click to expand...

They moved the rubber back three feet in college and high school softball and it was one of the clear side effects. You do get more balls put in play, but that also means a lot of them go foul as batters fight off pitches.
 
Halldan1 said:
The game is becoming unwatchable.

I know this is radical but they may have to move the mound back a little. Pitchers are now regularly hitting 97-100 MPH on the radar gun forcing batters to react sooner than ever.

And yeah, I know there are going to be complaints with the batters swinging for the fences regardless of the count. But even with that I think it's becoming incredibly difficult to just put good wood on the ball.
Click to expand...
I disagree. This has less to do with the velocity of the pitchers (don't get me wrong velocity is a part of it) and more to do with hitters approaches at the plate. If you make pitchers throw curveballs at a longer distance expect more injuries. The answer in my opinion is move the fences back. I know the complaints will be from owners about less seats, but are we really going to risk even more injuries to pitchers by moving the mound back? Not only will it be tougher for guys to go up to the plate looking for a home run, but the outfield will probably have to play deeper allowing more balls to fall in and wait for it.....contact will be rewarded. The truth is there are really only so many great pitchers now in the game. I strongly disagree with putting guys like deGrom and Cole at greater risk of injury because guys like Sanchez, Torres, and Conforto want to be home run hitters.
 
lloyde dobler said:
Moving the mound back will create a ton of extra foul balls, which will prolong games and pitch counts. Plus it’s not the speed, but the combination of speed and nasty movement that prompts many strikeouts. Now pitchers will be able to move the ball more if given an extra foot.
Click to expand...
Of course it's the movement of the ball. There's not a quality hitter in baseball that can't turnaround a straight 100 MPH pitch.

The reaction time to identify a pitch because of how hard pitchers are throwing it one of two reasons why there are so many strikeouts. That and the batters swinging for the fences regardless of the situation.

Single hitters help win games. But they don't often earn mega contracts.

Remember the old saying................

th
 
SHUHoopsFan said:
I disagree. This has less to do with the velocity of the pitchers (don't get me wrong velocity is a part of it) and more to do with hitters approaches at the plate. If you make pitchers throw curveballs at a longer distance expect more injuries. The answer in my opinion is move the fences back. I know the complaints will be from owners about less seats, but are we really going to risk even more injuries to pitchers by moving the mound back? Not only will it be tougher for guys to go up to the plate looking for a home run, but the outfield will probably have to play deeper allowing more balls to fall in and wait for it.....contact will be rewarded. The truth is there are really only so many great pitchers now in the game. I strongly disagree with putting guys like deGrom and Cole at greater risk of injury because guys like Sanchez, Torres, and Conforto want to be home run hitters.
Click to expand...

Rather than moving back fences, it’s easier to mess with the ball .... which they may or may not be doing.
 
lloyde dobler said:
Rather than moving back fences, it’s easier to mess with the ball .... which they may or may not be doing.
Click to expand...
That will work too. I'm all for ideas, I just think the most exciting play in the game could be the triple and moving the fences back 15-20 feet might help that.
 
Heard Theo Epstein on a podcast talk about this recently. He works for MLB now and is charged with finding ways to improve the game. Lack of contact/increases in strikeouts he says is the biggest complaint they hear about.

On moving the mound back, a concern they have is how that might lead to pitcher injuries.

On the ball, it is clear they tried to take some of the juice out of it this year, which is hurting the offensive stats. But if they “add back” the juice, it will just lead to the 3 outcome scenario folks find less appealing.

He believed the offensive woes so far and increasing strikeout trends this year are attributable to two things. First, analytics favoring home runs and players now training from a young age to emphasize elevating the ball at the sake of contact. Second, that pitchers are more equipped than ever to succeed. Training techniques that increase velocity. Data/analytics that guide pitchers on how and where to attack opposing hitters at an ultra-scientific level, with teams and pitchers better at executing their approach to minimize damage. Teams employing stables of high velocity arms in the pen (everyone now has them) and using their pens deeper and earlier than in the past. And pitchers being in much better shape and taking care of their bodies in a way you didn’t see even 15 years ago.

He thinks some orgs are going to scout, acquire and develop talent more geared towards contact, as if it is a new inefficiency the data-driven front offices can employ. He also thinks raising the strike zone is a definite possibility and will help increase contact rates and outcomes (like doubles and triples) that fans enjoy. But they aren’t there yet.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Fishjam and batts
The training and scouting by pitchers have changed the game. We will see which organizations are smart enough to adjust first.

Over the last 10 years hitters have adjusted their swings to produce more launch angle. Pitchers have now adapted by attacking the top of the strike zone after decades of keeping pitches down in the zone. Its difficult to catch up to 96-100 mph at the top of the zone with an uppercut swing. Time for hitters to swing more level.

There are many things they can change before they consider a drastic step like moving the mound back.

1) Reduce the number of relief pitchers on a roster. This means less pitching changes and more hitters on roster to increase platoons, Pinch Hitters and pinch-runners. Most teams carry 13 pitchers and only 12-13 hitters

2) Eliminate defensive shifts that have sapped batting averages for years

3) Put the DH in the NL

4) Crack down on pitchers using pine tar and other substances to increase grip and spin rate

5) Limit number of pitching changes per game

6) Allow only 1 pick off move per AB to increase SBs
 
  • Like
Reactions: Bluebeard and silkcitypirate
Fishjam said:
The training and scouting by pitchers have changed the game. We will see which organizations are smart enough to adjust first.

Over the last 10 years hitters have adjusted their swings to produce more launch angle. Pitchers have now adapted by attacking the top of the strike zone after decades of keeping pitches down in the zone. Its difficult to catch up to 96-100 mph at the top of the zone with an uppercut swing. Time for hitters to swing more level.

There are many things they can change before they consider a drastic step like moving the mound back.

1) Reduce the number of relief pitchers on a roster. This means less pitching changes and more hitters on roster to increase platoons, Pinch Hitters and pinch-runners. Most teams carry 13 pitchers and only 12-13 hitters

2) Eliminate defensive shifts that have sapped batting averages for years

3) Put the DH in the NL

4) Crack down on pitchers using pine tar and other substances to increase grip and spin rate

5) Limit number of pitching changes per game

6) Allow only 1 pick off move per AB to increase SBs
Click to expand...
Raising the bottom of the strike zone. I’m good with the DH in the NL. Some of the other stuff I wouldn’t like. Shifts have been around forever. Either beat it as a hitter or don’t. Don’t like limiting number of pitching changes or other artificial stuff.
 
Fishjam said:
The training and scouting by pitchers have changed the game. We will see which organizations are smart enough to adjust first.

Over the last 10 years hitters have adjusted their swings to produce more launch angle. Pitchers have now adapted by attacking the top of the strike zone after decades of keeping pitches down in the zone. Its difficult to catch up to 96-100 mph at the top of the zone with an uppercut swing. Time for hitters to swing more level.

There are many things they can change before they consider a drastic step like moving the mound back.

1) Reduce the number of relief pitchers on a roster. This means less pitching changes and more hitters on roster to increase platoons, Pinch Hitters and pinch-runners. Most teams carry 13 pitchers and only 12-13 hitters

2) Eliminate defensive shifts that have sapped batting averages for years

3) Put the DH in the NL

4) Crack down on pitchers using pine tar and other substances to increase grip and spin rate

5) Limit number of pitching changes per game

6) Allow only 1 pick off move per AB to increase SBs
Click to expand...

I don't like most of these because they mess with the fabric of the game itself. I hate the three batter minimum rule and I think legislating shifts, pickoff throws and pitching changes is akin to that. I also hate the idea of moving the pitchers mound back. I'd be fine with the DH in the National League especially since the reality is MLB is one League with two divisions and three sub-divisions at this point. Might as well play all the games under the same rule.

Think of what basketball would be like if teams could only play zone defense for 10 possessions a game or shoot only 10 three-pointers per game or attempt 10 shots in the paint.

Reducing the number of pitchers or limiting the number of pitching changes per game is just begging to ruin arms. That's not the way pitchers are developed these days and a shift like that would drastically change the game and likely not for good. You already have too many pitchers who can't make it through a season without getting hurt.
 
just reducing the strike zone would be better. Making the pitcher throw further would create more walks anyhow, so you might as well go back to the late 80’s/early to mid 90’s of a smaller strike zone. Make the top of the zone be just above the belt buckle again.
 
TheHall87 said:
I don't like most of these because they mess with the fabric of the game itself. I hate the three batter minimum rule and I think legislating shifts, pickoff throws and pitching changes is akin to that. I also hate the idea of moving the pitchers mound back. I'd be fine with the DH in the National League especially since the reality is MLB is one League with two divisions and three sub-divisions at this point. Might as well play all the games under the same rule.

Think of what basketball would be like if teams could only play zone defense for 10 possessions a game or shoot only 10 three-pointers per game or attempt 10 shots in the paint.

Reducing the number of pitchers or limiting the number of pitching changes per game is just begging to ruin arms. That's not the way pitchers are developed these days and a shift like that would drastically change the game and likely not for good. You already have too many pitchers who can't make it through a season without getting hurt.
Click to expand...
I tend to agree with thus take. But I chuckle a little when the dh, an abomination, was mentioned. Nothing messed with fabric of baseball more that that.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: Bluebeard
Fishjam said:
The training and scouting by pitchers have changed the game. We will see which organizations are smart enough to adjust first.

Over the last 10 years hitters have adjusted their swings to produce more launch angle. Pitchers have now adapted by attacking the top of the strike zone after decades of keeping pitches down in the zone. Its difficult to catch up to 96-100 mph at the top of the zone with an uppercut swing. Time for hitters to swing more level.

There are many things they can change before they consider a drastic step like moving the mound back.

1) Reduce the number of relief pitchers on a roster. This means less pitching changes and more hitters on roster to increase platoons, Pinch Hitters and pinch-runners. Most teams carry 13 pitchers and only 12-13 hitters

2) Eliminate defensive shifts that have sapped batting averages for years

3) Put the DH in the NL

4) Crack down on pitchers using pine tar and other substances to increase grip and spin rate

5) Limit number of pitching changes per game

6) Allow only 1 pick off move per AB to increase SBs
Click to expand...
Just my humble opinion

1. With all the pitching injuries and pitch counts baseball will never go for this.

2. Love this. This is where analytics has really hurt the offense. Pitchers would have to attack batters differently if there was no shift.

3. Love this. Baseball cannot have two sets of rules. I believe the National League is the only league in the world that does not have the DH.

4. Another good idea. But pitchers will tell you when it's cold or wet they have difficulty controlling the pitch which would lead to more dangerous hit batters.

5. Don't think that's much of a problem. That's like saying reduce pinch hitters.

6. Absolutely not. After the one pick-off move the runners on base would steal at nearly a 100% rate.
 
My biggest issue is with number 2. The game has always had a saying hit em where they ain't. The offensive player has the ability to destroy the shift. Bunts or weak contact to the vacated spot could lead to doubles. For over 100 years with a man on first, and the first baseman holding the runner on, lefties always had a big hole to hit through on their pull side. No one ever complained the hole is too big or they're taking away the double down the line. But when you make hole twice as a big on the other side of the diamond it's a problem? Imagine putting that same hole on the left side with Wade Boggs or Tony Gwynn, they would have the highest batting averages in baseball history. The players in today's game are one dimensional and the game shouldn't bow down to their inability to play it properly. In every other sport the offense adjusts it's approach based on what the defense gives them, why should baseball be any different. Imagine a basketball team running zone offense against man to man defense. Imagine a defense in football playing dime personnel all game and the QB never adjusting and running the ball. Hitters need to adjust and hit em where they aint.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: TheHall87 and shu09
Seton75 said:
I tend to agree with thus take. But I chuckle a little when the dh, an abomination, was mentioned. Nothing messed with fabric of baseball more that that.
Click to expand...

I suppose but that feels different than telling a team where to position defenders or that they can only use "x" number of pitchers in a game. Maybe that's 50 years of history with the DH talking. Why not make any pitch above 95 mph illegal while we're at it?

One more thought on the limit pitching changes idea. Here's a worse case scenario. My team is up 3-2 in the bottom of the ninth and my closer, my *fifth* and final pitcher of the game, is pitching. He gets hit by by a batted ball and has to leave the game. I have five (six, seven, eight) healthy pitchers on the bench but since I'm out of pitching changes, I have to use a position player to pitch? Do I forfeit the game?

If you tell me I can use another pitcher, that loophole will be abused to no end.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

S

2024 BIG EAST TOURNAMENT PREDICTION CONTEST

Replies
23
Views
515
Pirate Hoops Chat
CaptBob
C
Halldan1

Final as I see it

Replies
5
Views
668
Pirate Hoops Chat
jack 1970
J
Halldan1

As I see it

Replies
12
Views
792
Pirate Hoops Chat
ivyhillparkk1963
I
S

##### 2024 BIG EAST Prediction Contest: February 27-28 #####

Replies
23
Views
383
Pirate Hoops Chat
Hall84
H
Halldan1

As I see it

Replies
6
Views
646
Pirate Hoops Chat
hallstorm
H
ADVERTISEMENT

Latest posts

ADVERTISEMENT
Top Bottom
Back