Law Enforcement
- Thread starter NYShoreGuy
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Let the riots begin…enjoy the continued decline of major cities. Defund the police and BLM crowd getting some fresh air this weekend. These were very bad cops, but the entire profession will get piled on by those that want to advance their own agendas.
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When I asked them where my son was, they said, nearby. Nearby? What is nearby? I got nothing from them.
I think now that I’m actually putting things together, I believe they were trying to cover it up when they first came to my door. Mmhmm.
So around 4:00 in the morning, the doctors called from Saint Francis and said, Mrs. Wells, do you know your son’s in the hospital? And I said, Yes. I was advised by the police officers. He said, Why aren’t you here? And I said, The police officer said that I couldn’t come because he was under arrest.
The doctor proceeded to tell me that my son had went into cardiac arrest and that his kidneys were failing. This doesn’t sound consistent to somebody being tased or pepper sprayed.
When my husband and I got to the hospital, and I saw my son? He was already gone. They had beat him to a pulp. He had bruises all over him. His head was swollen like a watermelon. His neck was busting because of the swelling. They broke his neck. My son’s nose looked like a “s.” They actually just beat the crap out of him.
And so when I saw that, I knew my son was gone then. Even if he did live, he would have been a vegetable.
I think now that I’m actually putting things together, I believe they were trying to cover it up when they first came to my door. Mmhmm.
So around 4:00 in the morning, the doctors called from Saint Francis and said, Mrs. Wells, do you know your son’s in the hospital? And I said, Yes. I was advised by the police officers. He said, Why aren’t you here? And I said, The police officer said that I couldn’t come because he was under arrest.
The doctor proceeded to tell me that my son had went into cardiac arrest and that his kidneys were failing. This doesn’t sound consistent to somebody being tased or pepper sprayed.
When my husband and I got to the hospital, and I saw my son? He was already gone. They had beat him to a pulp. He had bruises all over him. His head was swollen like a watermelon. His neck was busting because of the swelling. They broke his neck. My son’s nose looked like a “s.” They actually just beat the crap out of him.
And so when I saw that, I knew my son was gone then. Even if he did live, he would have been a vegetable.
In all seriousness, the five cops have been fired and arrested swiftly. Isn’t that the way it supposed to work? Horrible situation, but what else are you expecting?
that is a REALLY brutal murder. when police fire all guys immediatly , before the body cam comes out, you know its bad. m
the skycam shows much more. awful. they ommitted some of the body cam footage. this clearly isnt their first rodeo. cops should be held to a higher stander, yet theres far too much of this where it cant help but come off as a pattern. and im pro cop.
the skycam shows much more. awful. they ommitted some of the body cam footage. this clearly isnt their first rodeo. cops should be held to a higher stander, yet theres far too much of this where it cant help but come off as a pattern. and im pro cop.
There are over 61 million police encounters each year. There are over 660,000 police officers in the U.S. Please share some proof that there is a “pattern”.
Pattern too strong of a word IMO.Kinda like saying just because Adam Schiff is an habitual liar all democrat politicians are liars.A lot of them are and a lot of republicans are but I can’t call either a pattern of lying ,but they are getting closer to being a pattern of lying.
I don't think anyone is objecting to justice being served afterwards.
It's just more about the frustration about how in the hell did these guys become cops in the first place and how can we ensure the public that police are not the enemy when there are monsters like these in uniform.
But you can say that about any profession. There are bad actors, who are doctors, attorneys, pilots. Some people will always get through the system become bad After they got the job.
What is equally concerning is that we continue to lower the bar and getting fewer good and qualified people interested in entering the profession.
There is always a lot of hot air rhetoric after something like this, but the reality is, it will take money for training, changes in laws and the justice system and compensation.
2022 had the highest number of people killed by police in the last decade. Trend line is certainly moving upwards over the last 10 years. Add that context of seeing them murdering someone and it becomes a bigger perception problem.
Sure. There are bad actors anywhere. Are we doing enough to mitigate that risk is the question.
Maybe we are. I don't have the answer.
But that’s your perception. We don’t know what is causing the increase in that stat. More criminals with guns on the street? More criminals engaging police in fire? More drugs? We just don’t know.
There are hundreds of thousands of illegal immigrants coming across our southern border, most of which are good people looking for a better life. There is a small number bringing drugs, human trafficking, etc. If we judge all those illegal immigrants by the acts of the few, we are racists.
Three are billions of Muslims, the religion of peace. Most are good, peaceful people. There are a small number that are terrorists. If we judge them all on the actions of the few, we are Islamophobic.
There are hundreds of thousands of police officers in the US. Most are lawful people taking pride in protecting and serving. There are a small percentage that break the law. Unfortunately, society and the media have chosen to judge all police officers on the actions of those few.
I'm not saying if any of it was justified or not.
Videos like this obviously creates a perception problem, and then you combine that with statistics where the number of people being killed by police is up that perception problem gets worse.
I think the FAR, FAR majority of police are good people, but these things are hard to deal with for public perception.
What I tell my two oldest kids -- there are "bad" apples in every professional, which we will never be able to avoid 100%, and "bad" cops have access to guns, tasers, clubs and armor. But the overwhelming majority cops help people every single day in so many ways that never get noticed, and that they when they see something like this occur they should also remember all the positive encounters and things they've seen our local police do.
Does it really matter if the shootings are justified? If a cop kills a suspect before they kill another citizen, he would think that’s a good thing. I don’t see the connection between police shootings and if cops are good or bad.
Let’s face it, perception gets shaped by the MSM and social media. And if these perceptions prevent good people from entering the profession, that’s not good for our society.
The most important thing we can do is deal with these issues, swiftly and transparently. I think the Chief in Memphis has done a great job in that respect.
You’re an engaged and responsible parent. We shouldn’t forget how important that is in a child’s upbringing.
Misread my response…I meant do the increase in numbers matter if the shootings were justified? Wouldn’t you only be interested in the trend of unjustified shootings instead.
Right, but we’re talking about a national perception problem. Am I personally interested in the actual data? of course.
Valid or not, there is a perception among the anti police crowd that too many police are bad. When a video like this comes out, it would certainly help to be able to say that the extra training or whatever may be working as less people are dying at the hands of police… but when more people are being killed by police, discussing the facts of each case and if they were justified or not is a much harder argument to make.
Maybe their perceptions are wrong and they should do the research?
Once again, you are pointing to police as the reason for the increase. Look at Philly that has record crime and homicides the last few years. More opportunities for police involvement that could be driving justified shootings. If the overall numbers are going up, but justified numbers increasing at a much faster rate, that should refute the perception.
Here is scary abstract from 40 years ago.
Seems like we have not progressed all that much.
Seems like we have not progressed all that much.
Indeed. It would be good if people took the time to understand the issues they are passionate about.
But overall violent crime was down in 2022.
Exactly. No one is digging into the detail was my point. The headlines is the story that the media sells.
https://www.statista.com/statistics/191129/reported-violent-crime-in-the-us-since-1990/
Actually violent crime has been on the rise the past ten years.
Without digging into the numbers it’s directional. Of those 1,200 or so each year, my “perception” is that with the increase in illegal drug trafficking, many of those civilian deaths could be related. Also have to look if they categorize unjustified or police charged criminally in this numbers. The vast majority of crime in our area is drug related…gang on gang, theft to support a habit, even family violence due to abuse.
We can always do better, but it will come down to money. Will the population of a city or state be willing to pay more for research, training, investment in pilot programs, increased compensation? We know the answer. Compound the fact that these were all African American officers with a AA police chief. Despite the horrific nature of the video, my guess this story will disappear in the news cycle in a few days compared to George Floyd which remained in the media for months.
I wish we as society had the same passion to save hundreds of thousands of lives that have been unnecessarily lost from prescription opioid use.
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Not sure where you are getting your data from.
The source I believe to be the most accurate is the FBI UCR data. 2022 has not been reported yet.
Here is a chart from the UCR Data Explorer. You have to scroll down once you open it.
Violent Crime includes a few types. Homicide, rape, robbery, and aggravated assault.
If you strip out rape and robbery, it is a different story.
Homicide and Aggravated Assault are on a pretty good uptick.
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is 5 guys mercilessly beating the life out of a guy really just qualified as bad actors? you think this was the first time they did something like this? i dont remember 5 attornies coordinating turns literally beating the life out of somebody.
Obviously criminal beat down,but why in almost all these type of cases do people not obey the police.Do what they say and don’t resist and sort it out later would eliminate most of these cases.
Not sure the point you are making. These five guys were bad dudes and deserve to get fired and charged…. are you saying this is systematic in law enforcement? Show me.
Isn’t that the point? You have a perception which you will support with a statistic, though there is no way for anyone to really know if the the deaths were justified or not without looking at each case.
The other side will have a perception which they will support with a statistic, though the same applies about really knowing if the deaths are justified or not.
All I was saying is the videos like this do so much damage to perception and I’m not sure how the police can improve their image easily after something like this.
Would prefer FBI data as well for 2022, but we’re not going to see that anytime soon. No arguing that rates went up with the pandemic. That was a major economic disruption and takes some time for the environment to cool off.
For now,
https://counciloncj.org/wp-content/uploads/2023/01/CCJ–Crime-Trends-Year-End-2022-Word-for-PDF.pdf
Videos shape the perception for sure and that’s where the MSM comes into play. Sharing certain videos with great frequency will shape a narrative. As I said earlier, this video is horrific, in some ways even worse than the George Floyd video, but it will be a distant memory by the Super Bowl.
The question is where do you put your money and legislative efforts.
I realized that's all that's available now but I'll wait for 2022 UCR data.
Page 27 of that shows the data source. Only 11-27 cities depending on the crime.
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