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Manafort

shu09

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Jan 6, 2006
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Reading through the indictment and it seems like this guy is as crooked as they come.

I haven't seen anything directly relating to the campaign but I think it reflects poorly on the President's judgement for hiring someone with this kind of background as his campaign chairman. That said, I see nothing in the complaint that would escalate this issue, as far as the President is concerned.
 
Sure Trump will try and distance himself from Manafort and Gates - but seeing the indictment, we get a feeling for how far reaching this investigation is and the FBI going after this level of money laundering, it would be naive to think Trump and his family will not be caught up in some very similar types of legal issues if you have read through some of the details on his real estate dealings... but again, as you stated, he was clearly as crooked as they come. There is a reason he was involved in the campaign. I expect we will learn more eventually, possibly related to a plea agreement.

but ... the much bigger news is that they also unsealed the Papadopoulos indictment who plead guilty almost a month ago to lying to the FBI related to contacts with Russians during the campaign. He has also been working with the FBI for the last month. He was attempting to set a meeting with Russians for hacked Hillary e-mails.

"On or about April 26, 2016, defendant PAPADOPOULOS met the Professor for breakfast at a London hotel. During this meeting, the Professor told defendant PAPADOPOULOS that he had just returned from a trip to Moscow where he had met with highlevel Russian government officials. The Professor told defendant PAPADOPOULOS that on that trip he (the Professor) learned that the Russians had obtained "dirt" on then-candidate Clinton"

"the day after his meeting at the hotel with the Professor, on or about April 27, 2016, defendant PAPADOPOULOS emailed the Senior Policy Advisor: "Have some interesting messages coming in from Moscow about a trip when the time is right."

Still at the tip of the iceberg here.
 
https://www.justice.gov/file/1007341/download

"The Government agrees to bring to the Court's attention at sentencing the defendant's efforts to cooperate with the Government, on the condition that your client continues to respond and provide information regarding any and all matters as to which the Government deems relevant."
 
Reading through the indictment and it seems like this guy is as crooked as they come.

I haven't seen anything directly relating to the campaign but I think it reflects poorly on the President's judgement for hiring someone with this kind of background as his campaign chairman. That said, I see nothing in the complaint that would escalate this issue, as far as the President is concerned.

This is still the beginning. Clearly, the Government has now indicted Manafort to put the squeeze on him. This is a typical tactic used to say hey, we have you. So help yourself and start talking about the Russians. Manafort is just a greedy crooked guy. Do you think he is going to take a hit for Trump? Or is he going to start to cooperate in order to save himself from spending a long time in jail. Apparently this is going to be a document case all based on financial paperwork.

By the way, notice that Flynn has not been indicted even though he is also guilty of not registering as a foreign agent. Does this mean Flynn is already cooperating? We shall see. But the noose suddenly got a little tighter for Trump.
 
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It had to be Manafort or Flynn - that was my guess. Trump surrounded himself with some very questionable characters. Manafort is clearly a slimeball. You lay with dogs and you get fleas.

Trump blew it again frankly when he fired Chris Christie from his transition team. Heard that behind the scenes Christie was not wanting some of these characters as part of the team at all and Trump's advisors pushed Christie away. Not saying Christie is a good guy but he has more political savvy than a lot of the knuckleheads Trump listened to.

Bigger picture though is that I hope that some of the good folks in the White House hang around like Tillerson and Mattis and Kelly. Those appear to be the best of his team and if the adults leave the White House we are in trouble with how the world is today.
 
It had to be Manafort or Flynn - that was my guess. Trump surrounded himself with some very questionable characters. Manafort is clearly a slimeball. You lay with dogs and you get fleas.

Trump blew it again frankly when he fired Chris Christie from his transition team. Heard that behind the scenes Christie was not wanting some of these characters as part of the team at all and Trump's advisors pushed Christie away. Not saying Christie is a good guy but he has more political savvy than a lot of the knuckleheads Trump listened to.

Bigger picture though is that I hope that some of the good folks in the White House hang around like Tillerson and Mattis and Kelly. Those appear to be the best of his team and if the adults leave the White House we are in trouble with how the world is today.
Good summary.
 
It had to be Manafort or Flynn - that was my guess. Trump surrounded himself with some very questionable characters. Manafort is clearly a slimeball. You lay with dogs and you get fleas.

Trump blew it again frankly when he fired Chris Christie from his transition team. Heard that behind the scenes Christie was not wanting some of these characters as part of the team at all and Trump's advisors pushed Christie away. Not saying Christie is a good guy but he has more political savvy than a lot of the knuckleheads Trump listened to.

Bigger picture though is that I hope that some of the good folks in the White House hang around like Tillerson and Mattis and Kelly. Those appear to be the best of his team and if the adults leave the White House we are in trouble with how the world is today.

Trump had no choice but to fire Christie because of Bridgegate. The question isn't do you want to avoid dirty people in politics, it's how much dirt can you have around you while convincing others you are clean. Manafort definitely dirty, but the opposition had such a clean guy in Podesta. lol It amazes me that in this country CEOs have to sign off that they are responsible for all things that happen in their company even if they don't know about it since Enron. But politicians like Podesta can say I had no clue we were paying Fusion GPS. $12 million dollar you had no clue of????
 
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Christie was not hired due to his relationship with Kushner.

While I think that was a part of it, I don't think it was as big of an issue as Bridgegate picking up steam in November 2016. Kushner's father and Christie situation goes back years. If Kushner had such a problem with it, why did he let Christie hang around from the primaries through the election? Wouldn't Kushner have gotten rid of him much earlier?
 
Bridgegate was a problem long before November 2016.

Kushner used his influence to block Christie when he had the opportunity to do so.
 
Bridgegate was a problem long before November 2016.

Kushner used his influence to block Christie when he had the opportunity to do so.

Yes but people were actually convicted November 2016. That was getting headlines.That became a game changer.
 
It is your opinion Bridgegate was the reason Christie does not have a position in the Trump administration.

It is my opinion that Christie putting Jared Kushner's father in jail is the reason Christie does not have a position in the Trump administration.
 
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All good points on Christie.

Should be interesting to see where this all leads.
 
Trump had no choice but to fire Christie because of Bridgegate. The question isn't do you want to avoid dirty people in politics, it's how much dirt can you have around you while convincing others you are clean. Manafort definitely dirty, but the opposition had such a clean guy in Podesta. lol It amazes me that in this country CEOs have to sign off that they are responsible for all things that happen in their company even if they don't know about it since Enron. But politicians like Podesta can say I had no clue we were paying Fusion GPS. $12 million dollar you had no clue of????

Podesta's e-mails were hacked during the campaign. Don't you think if he were guilty of something, it would have popped up by now and if he was aware of Fusions role, he would have mentioned them at some point in his private communications? It is possible that he didn't know since Fusion was engaged by his law firm and not the DNC directly, and again... there would be no reason for him to lie since what Fusion was doing was not against any laws.

Not saying he is clean. I have no allegiance to him, but he has been in the game a long time. He likely knows the rules, and how to play within them.
 
Podesta's e-mails were hacked during the campaign. Don't you think if he were guilty of something, it would have popped up by now and if he was aware of Fusions role, he would have mentioned them at some point in his private communications? It is possible that he didn't know since Fusion was engaged by his law firm and not the DNC directly, and again... there would be no reason for him to lie since what Fusion was doing was not against any laws.

Not saying he is clean. I have no allegiance to him, but he has been in the game a long time. He likely knows the rules, and how to play within them.

Do you think we know of every email out there? Yes it's definitely possible he didn't know. However my point was more to the fact he should be held responsible as any other CEO who makes the claim they didn't know of something that happened on his watch.

Just because you are in the game a long time and know the rules doesn't mean you play by them 100% of the time. Plenty of long time politicians who knew the rules didn't always follow them
 
So all of this is old news? Who was head of the FBI back then? Oh right, Robert Mueller.


Yulia Tymoshenko Warned Us About Paul Manafort Years Ago
Why didn't the Obama administration do anything?


Elizabeth Nolan Brown|Oct. 31, 2017 6:48 am
YuliaTymoshenko.jpg


In a civil complaint, the former Ukrainian prime minister accused Manafort—who would go on to chair Donald Trump's 2016 presidential campaign—of conspiring with Ukrainian and Russian partners to launder dirty money through "a labyrinth of shell companies" in the U.S.

These companies, it claims, "were solely used for purposes of furthering the unlawful objectives" of people like Dmytro Firtash, a Ukrainian businessman indicted in 2009 for U.S. racketeering and money laundering, and Russian crime boss Semyon Mogilevich, who made the FBI's "Most Wanted" list for suspected fraud, racketeering, and money laundering.

Documents filed in the civil action reveal many similar allegations to those Manafort and Gates are now facing at the hands of U.S. Department of Justice special prosecutor Robert Mueller.

On Monday, a federal grand jury indicted the former Trump-campaign chairman and Rick Gates, a Manafort business associate, for conspiracy to launder money, making false statements, failing to register as an agent of foreign principal, and failing to file reports on foreign bank accounts. (For a detailed breakdown of the charges, see Popehat.) They pleaded not guilty Monday afternoon.

The DOJ indictment accuses Manafort and Gates of "extensive lobbying" in the U.S. on behalf of Ukrainian interests and "in connection with the roll out of a report concerning the Tymoshenko trial commissioned by the Government of Ukraine."

Manafort and Gates paid $4 million to law firm Skadden Arps to monitor and report on the Tymoshenko proceedings, ostensibly on behalf of an "independent" European Centre for a Modern Ukraine (which they had helped set up), the indictment says. And it claims that "between at least 2006 and 2015, Manafort and Gates acted as unregistered agents of the Government of Ukraine, the Party of Regions (a Ukrainian political party whose leader Victor Yanukovych was President from 2010 to 2014), Yanukovych, and the Opposition Bloc (a successor to the Party of Regions that formed in 2014 when Yanukovych fled to Russia), generating "tens of millions of dollars in income as a result" and "launder[ing] the money through scores of United States and foreign corporations, partnerships, and bank accounts."

The work was done through Davis Manafort Partners (DMP), which Manafort co-founded in 2005, and DMP International (DMI), founded in Manafort and his wife Kathleen in 2011. Rick Gates worked for both entities Through these agencies, Manafort and Gates helped propel Viktor Yanukovych to the Ukrainian presidency and oversaw a "watchdog" report on the prosecution of his opposition.

Tymoshenko, who served as prime minster from 2007 through 2010, was not just an enemy of Tanukovych's but also of Firtash and Mogilevich. In an agreement with Russia, she helped cut Firtash's company out as a profitable middleman in natural-gas deals between the two countries.

Tymoshenko's suit against Firtash and unnamed Yanukovych officials was first filed in U.S. court in April 2011, when Yanukovych was still president. Later amended complaints were eventually filed—the second in November 2014, after Yanukovych had been forced to flee Ukraine amid protests over his administration's corruption and thuggery—and also named Manafort and his partners at CMZ Ventures.

The suit accused Manafort, Firtash, and the other defendants of financing politically motivated and "unlawful investigations and prosecutions of Tymoshenko" and her associates through secret payments to Yanukovich and others in his administration or control. Their money-laundering and shell-company scheme "was the proximate cause of Tymoshenko's damages, since it provided the necessary funds to make the unlawful payments to the Ukraine prosecutors and other corrupt administration officials," the complaint alleges.

Documents show that in December 2008, Manafort met with Firtash in the Ukraine, where Firtash agreed to an initial capital investment of $100 million in a global fund managed—for an initial fee of $1.5 million—by CMZ Ventures. An email sent by Gates in January 2009 summarizes the meeting, noting that Firtash's company "is still totally on board and a wire will be forthcoming either the end of this week or next week as a partial payment on the 1.5 [million]."

CMZ Ventures was jointly controlled by Manafort, Zackson, and Arthur and Karen Cohen. The suit claims this crew "defraud[ed] innocent third party real estate owners, investors and businesses... through sham real estate development and sales proposals that lured said third parties into thinking that defendants were making legitimate investments."

CMZ expressed interest in and made bids on flashy New York development projects like the Drake Hotel and St. Johns Terminal. But none of these deals went through—and they were never supposed to, claims Tymoshenko. The bids were merely a ploy to confer legitimacy on CMZ Ventures and attract more investors, whose money could be funneled into one of myriad U.S. and Panamanian accounts.

Former CMZ employees filed a New York labor-practices complaint against the company in 2009, accusing leaders of failing to pay them, not withholding payroll taxes or keeping proper records, not reimbursing them for travel costs, and "frequent creation of new Limited Liability Companies which serve as shell companies."

Scott Snizek, who would eventually join Tymoshenko's lawsuit, even sent Sens. Charles E. Schumer (D-N.Y.) and Kirsten Gillibrand (D-N.Y.) a letter begging them to look into "corporate wrongdoings in our own backyard" committed by Manafort and company, whom he described as figures "well-known and falsely respected by the public." His warning went unheeded.

And, in September 2015, Tymoshenko's suit was dismissed by a U.S. District Judge for lack of jurisdiction.

But in that suit lie the seeds of the current DOJ complaint against Manafort. The conspiracy Tymoshenko alleged may be worth revisiting.

Like the DOJ indictment, Tymoshenko's suit raised questions about law firm Skadden Arms and one of its partners, Gregory B. Craig, former White House counsel to Barack Obama. Documents seized from a former Yunukovych prosecutor's home included an August 2012 email from Craig to Manafort about the report, and an early draft of the Skadden report that had been annotated by Ukrainian government officials.

Tymoshenko theorized that Manafort and Gates had been commissioned to steer the investigation "away from certain sensitive areas (such as the massive, politically-motivated violations of human rights and suppression of political dissent) and towards less dangerous subjects (relatively minor procedural irregularities in the Tymoshenko investigations and prosecutions)."

Emails included Tymoshenko's case also show Gates and Manafort doing business with Russian oligarch Oleg Deripaska, who was denied entry to the U.S. in 2006 because of his alleged ties to organized Russian crime. The meeting between Deripaska and Manafort "is significant in that it confirms that Manafort had direct contacts with high-level Russian figures who were... under investigation by the FBI and [DOJ] for alleged money laundering and other criminal activities," it notes.

And according to Tymoshenko and co-defendants, there's no way Manafort didn't know what he was doing. As "a key advisor to former-President Yanukovych and other Ukraine political figures since 2003, he knew exactly how Firtash and his affiliated companies and co-conspirators were able to skim billions of dollars from the natural gas deals between Russia and Ukraine. He also knew that the monies were used to acquire ownership and control of various U.S.-based companies in furtherance of" racketeering, their suit states.

In doing so, "Manafort gave Firtash and his European-based co-conspirators the opportunity to participate with the U.S.-based defendants in a new Racketeering Enterprise focused on corporate acquisitions, money laundering and other racketeering activities in the United States, where it continues to operate," said the amended complaint in November 2014.

If only we had taken it seriously then.
 
Do you think we know of every email out there? Yes it's definitely possible he didn't know. However my point was more to the fact he should be held responsible as any other CEO who makes the claim they didn't know of something that happened on his watch.

I'm not sure what you mean by "he should be held responsible". Again, what fusion was doing was not illegal.
 
I'm not sure what you mean by "he should be held responsible". Again, what fusion was doing was not illegal.

CEOs are held responsible for all things within their company. They cannot claim they didn't know something was going on within their company. It's been that way since the Enron scandal. If they did nothing illegal, why plead the 5th?
 
CEOs are held responsible for all things within their company. They cannot claim they didn't know something was going on within their company. It's been that way since the Enron scandal. If they did nothing illegal, why plead the 5th?

and how does that relate to Podesta and Fusion?
 
and how does that relate to Podesta and Fusion?
It's obvious you think it's okay for Podesta to claim innocent of things that went on within a campaign he was in charge of. Not wasting any more time.
 
It's obvious you think it's okay for Podesta to claim innocent of things that went on within a campaign he was in charge of. Not wasting any more time.

Claim innocent of things that are legal?

If a law was broken, charge him with something... I don't care.
What happened at Enron was illegal. Was happened at Fusion was legal.
 
So all of this is old news? Who was head of the FBI back then? Oh right, Robert Mueller.

The end result of this investigation will likely be the result of Manafort having been watched by the FBI for years. They most likely had surveillance on him since before he joined the campaign. You don't charge someone based on an accusation. You build your case which is what they have been doing.
 
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