New Immigration Policy

[cernjSHU]

So what do people on this board have to say about the Raise Act? Legal immigration to this country that demands that certain criteria be met before having the chance to come to this country legally like speaking English, restricting the amount of green cards issued to 50% of what is issued now and restrict the pathway of legal citizenship for siblings and children.

I have never heard any complaints about legal immigration to this country. So why the change. The requirement that the immigrant speak English should be offensive as I Am sure many of our family when that came to our country did not speak English. Moreover, the first language spoken in this country other than Native American languages was Spanish. Spain settled St Augustine Florida 50 years before the English settled Jamestown. Spain also settled and explored most of the South, the Mississippi, the Southwest and California.

Moreover, this bill does nothing but increase the flow of illegal immigration to this country. I am not even going to talk about part of it. How will this increase wages? How does this take away jobs from Americans? You mean Americans want to work in the fields in agriculture, or restaurants in the kitchen?

 

[HALL85]

I haven't read all of the provisions of the act, but in general I do favor more guard rails and controlled management of our immigration process. There are additional costs that are borne by the system -taxpayers (i.e. Healthcare, social services, etc.). There is no endless pot of money and the cost of immigration must be considered.

I also don't see why you can't deal with improving the immigration process and dealing with illegal aliens at the same time. It's early, but illegal crossings are down significantly. And that's only a result of trumps rhetoric and increased border patrols.

The argument about "who will do the jobs if we don't have illegal immigrants" is weak IMO. Supply and demand. If there are fewer illegals to do those jobs, then employers will have to pay more for labor and the consumer will either bear that cost or do it themselves (mow their own lawn or not eat out as much).

It's funny, but the few people I have spoken with that have actually gone through the legal immigration process over the past 10 to 20 years are supportive of it.

 

[cernjSHU]

I haven't read all of the provisions of the act, but in general I do favor more guard rails and controlled management of our immigration process. There are additional costs that are borne by the system -taxpayers (i.e. Healthcare, social services, etc.). There is no endless pot of money and the cost of immigration must be considered.

I also don't see why you can't deal with improving the immigration process and dealing with illegal aliens at the same time. It's early, but illegal crossings are down significantly. And that's only a result of trumps rhetoric and increased border patrols.

The argument about "who will do the jobs if we don't have illegal immigrants" is weak IMO. Supply and demand. If there are fewer illegals to do those jobs, then employers will have to pay more for labor and the consumer will either bear that cost or do it themselves (mow their own lawn or not eat out as much).

It's funny, but the few people I have spoken with that have actually gone through the legal immigration process over the past 10 to 20 years are supportive of it.

You are talking about illegal immigration. The Raise Act is restricting LEGAL immigration.

 

[shu09]

I don't have a problem with it. It's a step that should result in fewer immigrants mooching off our welfare system when they get admitted. They'll have better skills and can get right to work when they come in.

That said, I don't think it will get through Congress. The special interests and people who practice identity politics will use their friends in the media to decrease public support for it.

 

[HALL85]

You are talking about illegal immigration. The Raise Act is restricting LEGAL immigration.

Go back and read my post. I am talking about legal immigration and responding to some of your points about illegals.

 

[Bobbie Solo]

I love the attempt at serious discussion above given to something so transparent. Trump has looked like utter shit to his base for a few weeks straight b/c of all the chaos amongst his staff and the failure to repeal the ACA. They were worried the troglodytes that backed him were starting to lose faith. So that grotesque slimeball Miller was working behind the scenes with Bannon on something they could trot out as pure red meat for their base. That's all that showy display was, part. with Miller showboating at the press conference. "Remember backwards thinking white people that voted for us & are somehow still in the 30-ish % of people that still love us: we still REALLY hate scary accents just like you!"

Meanwhile, unless I'm mistake this bill has to pass through Congress. It will die in the Senate as they have no chance of getting to 60 votes, even when/if the Dems bungle the 2018 midterms and lose more seats.

 

[Pirata]

Legal immigration to this country that demands that certain criteria be met before having the chance to come to this country legally like speaking English,

If you are basing your knowledge of the Raise Act on Trump's tweets or the WV rally then you are doing yourself a disservice.

Their is NO REQUIREMENT that an immigrant must speak English!

Raise is an employment based system taking cues from the points/merit based systems (Like those in Canada and Australia).

30 Points Needed in order to apply. http://time.com/4887574/trump-raise-act-immigration/

It rewards certain criteria, speaking English being one of them. It also rewards, education, past achievements, and other things indicative that the person will contribute rather than drain.

Full Text of the Bill: https://www.cotton.senate.gov/files/documents/170802_New_RAISE_Act_Bill_Text.pdf

 

[HALL85]

If you are basing your knowledge of the Raise Act on Trump's tweets or the WV rally then you are doing yourself a disservice.

Their is NO REQUIREMENT that an immigrant must speak English!

Raise is an employment based system taking cues from the points/merit based systems (Like those in Canada and Australia).

30 Points Needed in order to apply. http://time.com/4887574/trump-raise-act-immigration/

It rewards certain criteria, speaking English being one of them. It also rewards, education, past achievements, and other things indicative that the person will contribute rather than drain.

Full Text of the Bill: https://www.cotton.senate.gov/files/documents/170802_New_RAISE_Act_Bill_Text.pdf

Good to see that somebody actually read the bill, rather than a opining off the MSN talking points.

 

[HALL85]

I love the attempt at serious discussion above given to something so transparent. Trump has looked like utter shit to his base for a few weeks straight b/c of all the chaos amongst his staff and the failure to repeal the ACA. They were worried the troglodytes that backed him were starting to lose faith. So that grotesque slimeball Miller was working behind the scenes with Bannon on something they could trot out as pure red meat for their base. That's all that showy display was, part. with Miller showboating at the press conference. "Remember backwards thinking white people that voted for us & are somehow still in the 30-ish % of people that still love us: we still REALLY hate scary accents just like you!"

Meanwhile, unless I'm mistake this bill has to pass through Congress. It will die in the Senate as they have no chance of getting to 60 votes, even when/if the Dems bungle the 2018 midterms and lose more seats.

OK thanks. Now I really understand what "unhinged" means.

 

[cernjSHU]

If you are basing your knowledge of the Raise Act on Trump's tweets or the WV rally then you are doing yourself a disservice.

Their is NO REQUIREMENT that an immigrant must speak English!

Raise is an employment based system taking cues from the points/merit based systems (Like those in Canada and Australia).

30 Points Needed in order to apply. http://time.com/4887574/trump-raise-act-immigration/

It rewards certain criteria, speaking English being one of them. It also rewards, education, past achievements, and other things indicative that the person will contribute rather than drain.

Full Text of the Bill: https://www.cotton.senate.gov/files/documents/170802_New_RAISE_Act_Bill_Text.pdf

This is hysterical. I took the test needed in order to qualify to get into the country legally. I am a 50 yr old law school graduate. I barely got enough points to qualify. I scored 31 points.
So if you are not bringing in more than 1.3 million of capital that you intend to invest you get no points. Speaking English fluently is the most important factor worth 12 points. the only other factors worth more is if you have a US doctorate degree in science, math or engineering and have a job waiting for you over $155k.

However, its great if you have won a Nobel Prize (25 points) or an Olympic Medal (15 points). This is an absolute joke.

So if you are a 25 yr old with a US bachelor degree with a job for $75k waiting for him in the US and being fluent only gets you to 28 points. What a disgrace!

 

[Pirata]

You guys are playing small ball.

I guess you never heard of opening salvos in negotiating.

First you have to ask if you agree with the principle of a point/merit approach.

Once you get past that then you an debate, argue, negotiate the details of the points.

I don't think anyone thingks that is the final points scheme.

 

[Pirata]

I am a 50 yr old law school graduate.

That is a scary revelation. Lol (Just bustin your balls; don't go babalou)

I barely got enough points to qualify. I scored 31 points..

So to play along with your small ball:

Professional Degree - 13
Fluent 12
Job Offer 13 ( I assume that since you are an accomplished attorney)

That comes to 38. You're in.

I am surprised you and Solo have not been award a Nobel Prize for forum posting. That would have gotten 25 more! (Just more busting)


But again, I doubt this is the final points. It is just an opening bid.

 

[Pirata]

‘
‘Section 220 C (9) AGES 46 THROUGH 50.—An applicant who is at least 46 years of age and younger than 51 years of age shall accrue 2 points."


Cern, I just found you 2 more points. Hurry up an get your app in before your birthday!!

 

[Pirata]

This link provides a decent summary and includes perspectives of supporters and opponents.

It also gives it low odds of gaining any traction.

https://www.govtrack.us/congress/bills/115/s354/summary


One thing I found interesting in the opponent perspective is the citing of a similar law from 1964 that limited low skilled farm workers.

Referring to a similar bill that passed in 1964 and affected the farm industry, Nowrasteh writes, “Instead of hiring more American workers or raising their wages, farmers turned to machines and altered the crops they planted to take account of the new dearth of workers. Instead of planting crops that required labor-intensive harvesting or care, they planted other crops that required many fewer workers.”

The argument for today is that if we reduce low skilled immigration, it won't necessarily cause higher wages for US citizens who fill the void and take those jobs. (Landscaping, crop picking, domestics, dishwasers, etc)

One might argue, that it by reducing the cheap labor the long term effect is to facilitate automation to reduce or eliminate those job. Creating automation requires higher skilled labor. That is not necessarily a bad thing.

Example: Is it better to have 100 lower skilled low paid legal and illegal immigrants shucking and cutting corn at the cannery or should we have the $1M machine that does it better and faster? The argument is we attract more mechanical engineers into the country as opposed to corn shuckers.

Reminds me of when I was a young lad and my dad was laid off at the plant. He was replaced by a small device that did everything he did, but did it faster, better, and cheaper. The sad thing was that my mother went out and bought one. (Ba-da dum. )

 

[cernjSHU]

Pirata if you can't see the absurdity of this legislation, I don't know what to tell you. You think this is a grand scheme for negotiation? No, it's not. It is just trash legislation made up from very small minds who should be embarrassed by this.

Merit based system based on whose criteria. Does the Statue of Liberty say give me your brightest and richest and those who speak English fluently? Or does it say “Give me your tired, your poor, your huddled masses yearning to breathe free.”