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Soleimani - Iran

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Merge

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Nov 5, 2001
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Surprised the topic hasn't received any discussion here. I have been keeping an open mind on this since by all accounts it is a good thing that Soleimani is dead. At first I was ok with the strike if there really were intelligence assessments showing killing him would prevent Americans from being attacked. Now it seems like we are playing a word game of what imminent really means. This is why credibility is important though. Why should we believe anything from this administration when they lie about everything big and small? Trump's tweets from 2012 saying Obama will start a war with Iran to help him get re-elected certainly don't help matters either.

Trump tweeting out that we will target their cultural sites is really disturbing. Not sure how they can claim a deescalation policy after that, and the other members of his administration just brush it off like he never said it. Nikki Haley offering up that democrats are "mourning the loss of Soleimani" is pretty disgusting as well. She's starting to make her push to get on the 2020 ticket.

Response from Iran isn't unexpected in that they are saying they will retaliate and I am concerned that this will lead us into another war but I guess the good thing is that Trump is such a wildcard that Iran actually might be afraid of what he will do...
 
I think this entire thing is overblown. I doubt Iran does anything major because they know what it will lead to.
 
shu09 said:
I think this entire thing is overblown. I doubt Iran does anything major because they know what it will lead to.
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I hope you are correct, but to be fair, Soleimani was probably traveling in public because he doubted the US would target him because he knew what it would lead to.
 
Soleimani deserved to die, I only hope he suffered.

Would be nice to know what the intelligence showed. Imminent is only one piece, if there was chatter that he was involved in attacks being planned but not "imminent" it's still justification to kill him.

It's also great cover to get out of Iraq and tell them we are NEVER coming back, good luck with that.

Also tell Iraq, Iran, and all others that any attack or chatter on planning attacks on Americans will be met with swift and decisive justice. Love drone strikes.

<<< This is why credibility is important though. Why should we believe anything from this administration when they lie about everything big and small? >>>

What U.S. administration has ever been credible??

Doubtful Iran would do much militarily, Turkey would be an ally to the U.S., they want a piece of the action against Iran as well due to the Syrian situation. Even though it looked bad to placate Turkey with the Kurdish situation, in the long game, it was needed to help solidify ties with Turkey. Iran is not going to do anything in the strait of Hormuz, that would cripple their economy even more.

Biggest threat from Iran is probably cyber, which we are all vulnerable to these days.

This is also interesting, would love for them to do this:

https://www.redstate.com/streiff/20...plomats-took-bribes-create-iran-nuclear-deal/

Of course some dems are slobbering all over themselves in their hypocrisy.

https://www.breitbart.com/politics/...obamas-bold-decisive-strike-terrorist-leader/

<<< Trump's tweets from 2012 saying Obama will start a war with Iran to help him get re-elected certainly don't help matters either. >>>

How many of Trump's past tweets have come back to bite him in the ass, LOL? I can't count that high.

<<< Trump tweeting out that we will target their cultural sites is really disturbing. Not sure how they can claim a deescalation policy after that >>>

Wouldn't that be in response to further Iran actions though? It's against international law which means little, war is hell and so is retaliation.


Let's just hope none of this escalates from any side.
 
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SPK145 said:
Also tell Iraq, Iran, and all others that any attack or chatter on planning attacks on Americans will be met with swift and decisive justice.
Click to expand...

If we bombed based on chatter, there would be nothing left of the world.

SPK145 said:
What U.S. administration has ever been credible??
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Some criticism is certainly fair of all of them, but none in my lifetime have been as bad.

SPK145 said:
Doubtful Iran would do much militarily, Turkey would be an ally to the U.S., they want a piece of the action against Iran as well due to the Syrian situation. Even though it looked bad to placate Turkey with the Kurdish situation, in the long game, it was needed to help solidify ties with Turkey. Iran is not going to do anything in the strait of Hormuz, that would cripple their economy even more.
Click to expand...

I recognize I don't know enough about the region and how it would all play out. I do hope you are correct.

SPK145 said:
Wouldn't that be in response to further Iran actions though? It's against international law which means little, war is hell and so is retaliation.
Click to expand...

It's one thing if it's collateral damage. It is entirely another for the President to say they are targets. That was incredibly irresponsible of Trump. If any other foreign leader said the same thing we would call them a terrorist.

SPK145 said:
Let's just hope none of this escalates from any side.
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Agreed.
 
SPK145 said:
Soleimani deserved to die, I only hope he suffered.

Would be nice to know what the intelligence showed. Imminent is only one piece, if there was chatter that he was involved in attacks being planned but not "imminent" it's still justification to kill him.

It's also great cover to get out of Iraq and tell them we are NEVER coming back, good luck with that.

Also tell Iraq, Iran, and all others that any attack or chatter on planning attacks on Americans will be met with swift and decisive justice. Love drone strikes.

<<< This is why credibility is important though. Why should we believe anything from this administration when they lie about everything big and small? >>>

What U.S. administration has ever been credible??

Doubtful Iran would do much militarily, Turkey would be an ally to the U.S., they want a piece of the action against Iran as well due to the Syrian situation. Even though it looked bad to placate Turkey with the Kurdish situation, in the long game, it was needed to help solidify ties with Turkey. Iran is not going to do anything in the strait of Hormuz, that would cripple their economy even more.

Biggest threat from Iran is probably cyber, which we are all vulnerable to these days.

This is also interesting, would love for them to do this:

https://www.redstate.com/streiff/20...plomats-took-bribes-create-iran-nuclear-deal/

Of course some dems are slobbering all over themselves in their hypocrisy.

https://www.breitbart.com/politics/...obamas-bold-decisive-strike-terrorist-leader/

<<< Trump's tweets from 2012 saying Obama will start a war with Iran to help him get re-elected certainly don't help matters either. >>>

How many of Trump's past tweets have come back to bite him in the ass, LOL? I can't count that high.

<<< Trump tweeting out that we will target their cultural sites is really disturbing. Not sure how they can claim a deescalation policy after that >>>

Wouldn't that be in response to further Iran actions though? It's against international law which means little, war is hell and so is retaliation.


Let's just hope none of this escalates from any side.
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Very good summary.

What’s been most disturbing to me is hearing the way some members of Congress every acted along with much of the MSM coverage.
 
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SPK145 said:
So we wait for attacks to happen first? No prevention? Another 9/11?

That would be so irresponsible and deadly. Thanks.
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We do act on chatter to prevent attacks. Just saying there is a huge amount of chatter, and it is a lot more complex than saying we will send in drones based on chatter... though, I probably stretched the meaning of your original point of chatter to be broader than you intended, so I apologize for that.

We are probably not far off on how we would want our government to respond to chatter that they find to be a credible threat.
 
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Merge said:
We do act on chatter to prevent attacks. Just saying there is a huge amount of chatter, and it is a lot more complex than saying we will send in drones based on chatter... though, I probably stretched the meaning of your original point of chatter to be broader than you intended, so I apologize for that.

We are probably not far off on how we would want our government to respond to chatter that they find to be a credible threat.
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Exactly.
 
Well so much for being overblown. Exactly what I was worried about. Iran would further escalate and we have zero good options.

Praying for those who are over there and those who will likely be sent that they are not harmed and our leadership figures out a way to deescalate quickly.
 
The solution is simple. Do not respond, condemn this move against a sovereign Iraq. Would be a bonus if we announced we were pulling all our troops from Iraq given the recent vote.
 
I agree that is the best option, but is not a good one for Trump politically.
 
Merge said:
I agree that is the best option, but is not a good one for Trump politically.
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I think it's a very good one for him politically. Changes the narrative. Might even get him re-elected.
 
I tend to agree. We should not retaliate. We got what we wanted which was to send a message and tell them be careful as we will respond quickly. That has to have them on edge.

My biggest hope now is that this settles down and the US does not retaliate publicly. Trump should have shut his damn mouth after the attack. it would have been much more effective IMO. Speak softly and carry a big stick. He could not possibly understand that saying unfortunately.
 
Section112 said:
I tend to agree. We should not retaliate. We got what we wanted which was to send a message and tell them be careful as we will respond quickly. That has to have them on edge.

My biggest hope now is that this settles down and the US does not retaliate publicly. Trump should have shut his damn mouth after the attack. it would have been much more effective IMO. Speak softly and carry a big stick. He could not possibly understand that saying unfortunately.
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This really gives both the U.S. and Iran an off-ramp (new popular term) to de-escalate. You wonder if we did Iran a favor by taking out Soleimani. He certainly had his enemies there and perhaps an impediment for Rouhani, if he had any plans to engage the U.S., since the sanctions were having an impact. We need to let this play out as everyone has indicated.
 
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The reality of the nuclear agreement was Iran was not abiding by it and never intended to. They were just trying to get their economy going and were willing to do whatever it took to do so. I am fairly certain we have intel that says they are enriching uranium and will have if they don't already nuclear capability very soon and the agreement did nothing to stop that.

I'm hopeful but not unrealistic that we get out of Iraq and Afghanistan very soon.
 
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Trump nailed it. He gets high marks from me on his handling of this issue.

Iran could have hit much harder if it wanted to, and Trump and his people realized this. They had to do something to appease the angry people in their own country, but they know that provoking the US further would not be good for their country.
 
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shu09 said:
Trump nailed it. He gets high marks from me on his handling of this issue.

Iran could have hit much harder if it wanted to, and Trump and his people realized this. They had to do something to appease the angry people in their own country, but they know that provoking the US further would not be good for their country.
Click to expand...

Agreed. So far, this is playing out pretty well.
 
Merge said:
Agreed. So far, this is playing out pretty well.
Click to expand...

As I thought it would. Overblown, both countries know that escalations and/or war would not be good for either country. Plus, Trump knows it isn't good for him politically either as it would lead to a declining stock market, rising oil prices, more anger from the left directed at him and he would risk losing some of his base that wants to end Middle East wars.
 
shu09 said:
As I thought it would. Overblown, both countries know that escalations and/or war would not be good for either country. Plus, Trump knows it isn't good for him politically either as it would lead to a declining stock market, rising oil prices, more anger from the left directed at him and he would risk losing some of his base that wants to end Middle East wars.
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Now the question is what's next? Trump imploring other countries that were in on the Iranian deal to come back and work with the U.S.. Anyone calling him an assassin today?
 
HALL85 said:
Trump imploring other countries that were in on the Iranian deal to come back and work with the U.S..
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Asking them to work with them after he killed the deal without trying to work with them on improving it? Not sure why they would want to work with him now.
 
Merge said:
Asking them to work with them after he killed the deal without trying to work with them on improving it? Not sure why they would want to work with him now.
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If by killing Soleimani re-opens discussions with Rouhani for a new agreement, why wouldn’t they want to come to the table? It’s probably all posturing anyway, but it’s certainly possible.
 
Democrats are embarrasing themselves as usual with this. Kissing the feet of Iran, showing their true colors.

Iran also incompetently shot down a commercial airliner killing 176 people. I know it's not proven yet but that is what happened.
 
SPK145 said:
And of all things, a Ukrainian airliner. Makes me wonder just a little who exactly was on that plane.
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It does make you wonder. CBS reported this morning that nine other commercial jets left Tehran airport that morning before the Ukrainian flight in the same flight path.
 
Merge said:
Can you provide an example of that?



Correct, that is horrible.
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Jackie Spier was on CNN spewing high garbage that this is on Trump, and I've seen other takes from Dems as well. Did you really think they wouldnt blame it on trump?
 
Not sure but you have this triangle of Russia who wants to own Ukraine, their ally Iran and Russia wants to show the world they are still a super power and will meddle in everything. Iran does Russia a favor and feels good about Russia protecting them. Is Russia getting wary of Trump because he will not back down and showed it by killing Solemeini? Was this a signal or was there a key person on that plane that could help Trump in some way? Russia is loving the impeachment because they want instability. Something smells here and the timing is suspect as well...
 
kniespolice said:
Jackie Spier was on CNN spewing high garbage that this is on Trump, and I've seen other takes from Dems as well. Did you really think they wouldnt blame it on trump?
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That's quite a leap to “kissing the feet of Iran”?
 
Section112 said:
Pete B also implied Trump is to blame. https://dailycaller.com/2020/01/09/...iTJjV8ZpW_1FoFbc_utnCqbF5FXibOMl68HK45GtejCKA
Click to expand...

Not quite blame...
Assuming for a moment that it was shot down accidentally, that plane is collateral damage and those people would still be alive if we did not kill Soleimani. It should be part of the discussion in regards to our threat assessment and the "imminence" of a plot against the United States.

Though, you are right. Something does smell here.
 
Merge said:
Not quite blame...
Assuming for a moment that it was shot down accidentally, that plane is collateral damage and those people would still be alive if we did not kill Soleimani. It should be part of the discussion in regards to our threat assessment and the "imminence" of a plot against the United States.

Though, you are right. Something does smell here.
Click to expand...

I guess you can argue they'd still be alive if not for killing Sol. but even remotely saying America or Trump has blood on his hands for Iran incompetence is not correct.
 
Merge said:
Not quite blame...
Assuming for a moment that it was shot down accidentally, that plane is collateral damage and those people would still be alive if we did not kill Soleimani. It should be part of the discussion in regards to our threat assessment and the "imminence" of a plot against the United States.

Though, you are right. Something does smell here.
Click to expand...

Disagree with this vehemently, a terrible take on this.
 
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Section112 said:
Not sure but you have this triangle of Russia who wants to own Ukraine, their ally Iran and Russia wants to show the world they are still a super power and will meddle in everything. Iran does Russia a favor and feels good about Russia protecting them. Is Russia getting wary of Trump because he will not back down and showed it by killing Solemeini? Was this a signal or was there a key person on that plane that could help Trump in some way? Russia is loving the impeachment because they want instability. Something smells here and the timing is suspect as well...
Click to expand...

I was thinking the opposite, someone who could hurt Trump may have been on that plane. Just seems shady all the way around how Iran gave us advanced warning, etc.

I’m now a full fledged member of Merge’s conspiracy group.
 
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SPK145 said:
Disagree with this vehemently, a terrible take on this.
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This is like saying that Iran would be at fault if we shot down a US airliner taking off out of DC on the same night as the missiles because we were anxious Iran was bombing the Capitol. Its obnoxious.
 
SPK145 said:
I was thinking the opposite, someone who could hurt Trump may have been on that plane. Just seems shady all the way around how Iran gave us advanced warning, etc.

I’m now a full fledged member of Merge’s conspiracy group.
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Getting the advance warning was also curious/fishy. Like I said earlier, is it possible Soleimiani was a major impediment to Rouhani. Internal power struggle and we did Rouhani's dirty work for a deal to be made later?
 
SPK145 said:
Disagree with this vehemently, a terrible take on this.
Click to expand...

In what way?

Would those people be alive if we did not kill Soleimani?

I personally would like to have a basic understanding if we had a chance to kill him in the last three years, and if there was a change in the intelligence we reviewed more recently which suggested killing him now was necessary... or if someone needed a distraction from impeachment.
 
HALL85 said:
Getting the advance warning was also curious/fishy. Like I said earlier, is it possible Soleimiani was a major impediment to Rouhani. Internal power struggle and we did Rouhani's dirty work for a deal to be made later?
Click to expand...

So, conspiracy theories are cool now that you like this one?
 
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