Initial KenPom 2024-25
- Thread starter Piratz
- Start date
It's amazing that CBS, which is inextricably linked to the NCAA Tournament, is the only major outlet that really props up this clown. Almost anyone they could use would be better.
5 Big East teams in the top 22 and Seton Hall 91. Sure, we’ll see. Board material
It's good that the big east is getting some preseason respect. You guys are definitely under ranked. It's bulletin board material.
For what it's worth, how good a job Holloway did last year with what he had is underappreciated, even on this board. Hopefully, this year will actually have a big east rep on the committee who stands up for big east teams.
For what it's worth, how good a job Holloway did last year with what he had is underappreciated, even on this board. Hopefully, this year will actually have a big east rep on the committee who stands up for big east teams.
Well I do like that there is only 1 team from the Big 10 in the entire top 22.
I expect us to be rated this way however, I believe we have some intriguing players who could surprise under Holloway.
It will be interesting playing in Charleston
I expect us to be rated this way however, I believe we have some intriguing players who could surprise under Holloway.
It will be interesting playing in Charleston
Our entire roster is unproven. This rating doesn’t surprise me at all.
I think you may be confusing kenpom with Jerry Palm. Two different poms/palms. Kenpom is propped up by everyone as the gold standard of college hoops analytics/rankings. Jerry Palm is CBS’s sub-mediocre bracketology guy.
Yup, you're absolutely right. Hey, it's the preseason for fans, too! I'll be game-ready next month!
Charleston Classic Field
VCU - 41
Miami - 55
Nevada - 73
Ok State - 89
SHU - 91
Vandy - 96
Florida Atl. - 104
Drake - 133
VCU - 41
Miami - 55
Nevada - 73
Ok State - 89
SHU - 91
Vandy - 96
Florida Atl. - 104
Drake - 133
Has us 10th out of 11 in the Big East. 13-16 overall, 7-13 in BE. On paper, looking at the rosters, those aren't far-fetched predictions. But the Sha factor will bump us up some.
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His analytics are nearly impossible to gauge in the preseason in this environment of Free Agency and roster turnover. There was much more reliability in the past when the turnover was less and the continuity higher.
I think the number is reasonable for Seton Hall if you take into account all the past data of individual players. But roles will change, dynamics change, teams are different, coaching, etc. and that’s going to make it fun to watch. We’re not going to be seen a preseason star team by human or computer.
I think the number is reasonable for Seton Hall if you take into account all the past data of individual players. But roles will change, dynamics change, teams are different, coaching, etc. and that’s going to make it fun to watch. We’re not going to be seen a preseason star team by human or computer.
No denying that Kenpom is well-respected. But imho pre-season rankings mean very very little. All that matters is how things shake out once the season starts. My money is on Sha's proven track record. He will get this team to rise above the sum of its parts.
Until our roster has players who are highly rated coming into the program either as an incoming freshman or as a portal transfer we’re not going to be ranked highly in the preseason.
It's amazing how quickly the "shine" can come off for the pundits who do this stuff for a living, because many of our guys were highly-rated just a year ago. But that's how this stuff works.
91 is just way too low and no way should Seton Hall be behind Butler and Georgetown.
Villanova at no. 20? LOL!!
Villanova at no. 20? LOL!!
The problem with preseason KenPom is it assigns a number to something that is metrics based. We’ve seen it takes a lot to move numbers through the year.
Everyone should start 0.000. Arbitrarily assigning a metrics rank with no metrics is stupid.
Everyone should start 0.000. Arbitrarily assigning a metrics rank with no metrics is stupid.
This is exactly how I feel. On paper I think this is about a 7-13 BigEast team, but due to the Sha factor I would bump them up to 8-10.
I’m not a mathematician, but I believe that’s impossible, because certain values have to be assigned due to the multiples involved in the formula.
Sounds about right to me. 6 BE teams in the top 30, though I don't know about Villanova being there.
I don't see any good reasons to rank Seton Hall any better than 9th or 10th in the league so a ranking in the 80s or 90s overall seems appropriate.
I don't see any good reasons to rank Seton Hall any better than 9th or 10th in the league so a ranking in the 80s or 90s overall seems appropriate.
We’re probably properly ranked at this point, I just don’t like that he releases a metrics-based formula before games are played. I probably wouldn’t even mind a starting point if it was embedded and first metrics released 12/1.
It would be even less reliable as an indicator if it zeroed. The NET and Quad System is supposed to be more of that weighing outcomes versus productivity.
The Hall has its ethos: We’re going to be a program that outperforms and fights annually. It’s also what Sha likes to coach and motivate off and, in the NIL Era, we don’t have a choice either unless we retain top players and not losing them every year (Samuel, Richmond, Davis). Then maybe we have preseason hype/projections.
Otherwise we’re going to rely on transfers that weren’t stars and developing them. That doesn’t look great to KenPom.
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The NIL seems to be improving, but we also need to hope that playing under Sha will make kids want to stay because they view that as the best option long term. If someone is offering you equal to more $$$ and has a coach with a pedigree of development, success and the like, it’s really hard to turn that down. If someone is offering you more or equal NIl but whose HC isn’t nearly as attractive, it’s a different equation IMO.
My problem is Kenpom assumes teams “should” win by certain margins and if a team goes 15-0 but only wins by an average of 4 points, he assumes they’ll regress to losing some games.
It’s a style points system that tries to integrate individualized past performance into a team game.
I would be fine with it if I never saw it in a composure box when February NCAA hopefuls emerge.
* composite box
It’s a style points system that tries to integrate individualized past performance into a team game.
I would be fine with it if I never saw it in a composure box when February NCAA hopefuls emerge.
* composite box
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Well yeah there’s a logic to if you’re perpetually playing close games against all opponent types something is limited.
But overall yes results matter to me and should to everyone first. If you’re living a charmed life by going 25-5 and won every game close so be it. 25-5 is 25-5.
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