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More NYC trouble

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HALL85

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https://nypost.com/2022/09/20/record-number-of-new-yorkers-swap-to-florida-licenses/

This is telling as these are the people that will work 6 months and a day minimum in FL at minimum. Heard an interview today: 50% of NYC office employees are now WFH; only 9% go to the office 5 days a week; international travel is down overall but hurting NYC more because they depend more on it; Broadway attendance is still way down. Facing multi-billion dollar deficits over the next three years.
 
NYC Tax on income: 3-4% Florida is 0% except for a few cities.
NYS Tax on income : 4-9% - Florida is 0%

It nets to 7 - 13% pay raise with a much lower cost of living in general.

With the homestead reduction on property taxes, you can do well their there also.

Rents have hit $5,000 a month in NYC.
 
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NYC will be fine.
Still plenty of people want to live there. Rent prices are up. Vacancies are down.

Wouldn’t really worry too much about Broadway either. Still recovering from closing during a pandemic but getting back to normal.
 
Merge said:
NYC will be fine.
Still plenty of people want to live there. Rent prices are up. Vacancies are down.

Wouldn’t really worry too much about Broadway either. Still recovering from closing during a pandemic but getting back to normal.
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I thought you respond to statistics.
 
if i didnt hate florida (i can see why people like it), id definitely consider moving there to take advantage of the tax.
 
SHUSA said:
if i didnt hate florida (i can see why people like it), id definitely consider moving there to take advantage of the tax.
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I used to be the biggest anti-Florida NY/NJ type walking this earth. Until the past 2 years. Changed everything. I'm a NJ/NYer at heart, no doubt, but I totally get why people are fleeing to Florida in droves.
 
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Merge said:
NYC will be fine.
Still plenty of people want to live there. Rent prices are up. Vacancies are down.

Wouldn’t really worry too much about Broadway either. Still recovering from closing during a pandemic but getting back to normal.
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I think the rental market will always be fine. Maybe that's the optimist in me.

I worry about the business community, especially all those dining and coffee places, etc, that rely so much on the weekday foot-traffic. With WFH becoming more the standard instead of the exception for many businesses and sectors. And while this is anecdotal, I know a number of young families that were NYC diehards and moved after the past 2 years. Not only because of the COVID-stuff, but also schools and crime.
 
dehere23 said:
I think the rental market will always be fine. Maybe that's the optimist in me.

I worry about the business community, especially all those dining and coffee places, etc, that rely so much on the weekday foot-traffic. With WFH becoming more the standard instead of the exception for many businesses and sectors. And while this is anecdotal, I know a number of young families that were NYC diehards and moved after the past 2 years. Not only because of the COVID-stuff, but also schools and crime.
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you forget that a lot of young families typically move out of the city anyway. in fact most do.

nyc will survive, but will take a bit of time to get the magic back. dont think its there right now.

i wouldnt worry about the shops that rely on work traffic. much worse for basically all of the other cities
 
I know many do. I did. Many of my friends too. I’m talking about the tried and true types that either grew up there or swore post-kids they would never leave. When you live on the UWS or UES the past few years it’s a different world than what it was the prior two decades.
 
Right now wages are up and unemployment is way down. If the job market turns back to the side of the employers, things will get ugly fast. Texas is sending on average 7 bus loads of illegals a day. Even if you took 1/2 of that say 100 people a day over the next 6 months, what kind of impact will that have? Factor in rising crime, WFH and NYC may take awhile to fully recover. It is the greatest city on the planet, so history is on its side.
 
dehere23 said:
I think the rental market will always be fine. Maybe that's the optimist in me.

I worry about the business community, especially all those dining and coffee places, etc, that rely so much on the weekday foot-traffic. With WFH becoming more the standard instead of the exception for many businesses and sectors. And while this is anecdotal, I know a number of young families that were NYC diehards and moved after the past 2 years. Not only because of the COVID-stuff, but also schools and crime.
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Yea, i agree it’s not quite back to normal yet but things there have turned around quite a bit, especially the real estate.

The mass exodus people thought might happen just really didn’t occur. People left, but they were replaced.
 
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I love Florida. Been going there all my life. But i have been there enough times to know that it’s not just sunshine. Good paying jobs are hard to find there, the public education system is atrocious and too many people in Florida that are running away from something in their home state.

Id never live there in my 20-50’s. But, as I get closer to retirement in the next decade, I would love to live there 6 months. Come back to NJ in the summer. Such is the plan anyway.
 
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Never understood the appeal of city living, especially New York, but that's just me. I'd take Florida all day and just deal with the heat/humidity.
 
The numbers speak for themselves. More people are leaving and it’s advantageous to preserve significantly more wealth especially if you can do the six month and a day. Pandemic has created opportunities for NY based employees to work remote part or full time. My daughter and her husband moved out of Brooklyn to Essex County last year. He is now 95% remote and she is 40% remote (both were FT office prior to pandemic).

Same thing happening out west. Areas like Provo, Pocatello, Austin, etc. are seeing tons of California transplants. Issue cities will have to deal with is crime and quality of life. Something has to give…bigger deficits will make it more challenging to address crime. Mental health and drug issues exploding as well.
 
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shu09 said:
Never understood the appeal of city living, especially New York, but that's just me. I'd take Florida all day and just deal with the heat/humidity.
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To each their own. I love NYC. Splitting time between Florida and NY would be ideal for me after my kids are on their own.
 
NYC & LI have no appeal to me, but the rest of NY is great. Catskills, Adirondack, Finger Lakea, Hudson Valley, Thousand Islands, all beautiful places.
 
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shu09 said:
Never understood the appeal of city living, especially New York, but that's just me. I'd take Florida all day and just deal with the heat/humidity.
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One of my regrets in life was never living in Manhattan. I worked there for a couple of years and loved it. NYC is a spectacular city. So much to do!
 
cernjSHU said:
One of my regrets in life was never living in Manhattan. I worked there for a couple of years and loved it. NYC is a spectacular city. So much to do!
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Growing up in the shadow of Manhattan in the meadowlands, it was great to take advantage and hop a bus or drive and be in mid-town in 15 minutes. Yankee games, Broadway shows, Little Italy, concerts at MSG, bar scene, etc. Up until two years ago, we would be there at least once a month. Even after 9/11, that didn't stop us. However, the last two and a half years, have been there exactly once (to see the Van Goph exhibit). Not hitting my radar anymore even though I've had invitations. Went out to the Hamptons a couple of months ago passing through the city and was amazed at how bad the infrastructure has gotten so quickly.
 
HALL85 said:
Growing up in the shadow of Manhattan in the meadowlands, it was great to take advantage and hop a bus or drive and be in mid-town in 15 minutes. Yankee games, Broadway shows, Little Italy, concerts at MSG, bar scene, etc. Up until two years ago, we would be there at least once a month. Even after 9/11, that didn't stop us. However, the last two and a half years, have been there exactly once (to see the Van Goph exhibit). Not hitting my radar anymore even though I've had invitations. Went out to the Hamptons a couple of months ago passing through the city and was amazed at how bad the infrastructure has gotten so quickly.
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can you elaborate on how you were able to come to that conclusion on nycs entire infrastructure from just passing through? did you take the train to the hamptons?
 
SHUSA said:
can you elaborate on how you were able to come to that conclusion on nycs entire infrastructure from just passing through? did you take the train to the hamptons?
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GWB, Cross Bronx, Whitestone Bridge and LIE on the way out. Drove back on the BQE, Williamsburg Bridge and Holland tunnel. Like a Third World country.
 
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HALL85 said:
GWB, Cross Bronx, Whitestone Bridge and LIE on the way out. Drove back on the BQE, Williamsburg Bridge and Holland tunnel. Like a Third World country.
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what about it is 3rd world? the design of those have always been terrible esp cross bronx. are they crumbling?
 
cernjSHU said:
I love Florida. Been going there all my life. But i have been there enough times to know that it’s not just sunshine. Good paying jobs are hard to find there, the public education system is atrocious and too many people in Florida that are running away from something in their home state.

Id never live there in my 20-50’s. But, as I get closer to retirement in the next decade, I would love to live there 6 months. Come back to NJ in the summer. Such is the plan anyway.
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I had the same views on living as Florida re: schools, lack of high paying jobs, and just always reading about crazy stuff going on there. You still read about some crazy stuff. But a few years ago I started working at a place where most of my colleagues live in Florida. My sector contains a mix of many high-paying, as well as mid/low paying jobs, depending on what you do. The schools are in a much better place over the past few years -- many of them who used to send their kids to private schools now send their kids to public. And their schools actually stayed open by and large the past few years, which seems like an uncontroversial point but one I'll no longer take for granted. Various cities are also seeing an economic boom, including Miami. Companies are moving there. High-paying or mid-paying jobs are already there and growing. Remote work also allows high or mid-level earners to be there but get paid rates historically attributable to other markets. The Florida I thought I knew 10 years ago is way different than what it is today. And, again, that's coming from someone who has the biggest NY/NJ "king of the world" complex out there.
 
cernjSHU said:
One of my regrets in life was never living in Manhattan. I worked there for a couple of years and loved it. NYC is a spectacular city. So much to do!
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Living in NYC was awesome. I did it for several years, and loved every second of it. Don't regret it one iota. I also lived there pre-kids and when crime/homelessness wasn't a concern. I'd still buy an apartment there as an investment or to have when I'm older. Although the tax and regulation climate is somewhat prohibitive on that, not to mention the issues you have as a landlord evicting someone who isn't paying rent.
 
shu09 said:
What do you mean?
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well from what you post it sounds like you came out of the womb as a 50yr old man who yells at clouds (or missed out on your 20s). i think anyone with a shred of intrigue understands why new york or any city are attractive to some people.

these places are the the source of culture and diversity in the world. not just racial culture or diversity. its where the arts are, great feats of engineering, and world with interesting people with interesting stories. all the best food, lounges, museums, music, concerts, theater, sports, and clubs happen in cities. Friends, acquainences, around every corner. Rick Steves said the people are the best part of travelling. dont be shy. Its amazing the endless discovery that happens in cities, esp new york. you could have the most obscure hobby in the world and have a weekly club of 30 people doing the same.

i can see if youre a scrooge with no friends, no hobbies, and no interests why you dont understand the allure of living in cities. its not just a place to scoff at people drinking. you dont have to want to live there, but its not hard to find the appeal. im not a huge elvis fan, but i get it.
 
SHUSA said:
well from what you post it sounds like you came out of the womb as a 50yr old man who yells at clouds (or missed out on your 20s). i think anyone with a shred of intrigue understands why new york or any city are attractive to some people.

these places are the the source of culture and diversity in the world. not just racial culture or diversity. its where the arts are, great feats of engineering, and world with interesting people with interesting stories. all the best food, lounges, museums, music, concerts, theater, sports, and clubs happen in cities. Friends, acquainences, around every corner. Rick Steves said the people are the best part of travelling. dont be shy. Its amazing the endless discovery that happens in cities, esp new york. you could have the most obscure hobby in the world and have a weekly club of 30 people doing the same.

i can see if youre a scrooge with no friends, no hobbies, and no interests why you dont understand the allure of living in cities. its not just a place to scoff at people drinking. you dont have to want to live there, but its not hard to find the appeal. im not a huge elvis fan, but i get it.
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I said I can see why some people do it, it just isn't for me. A bunch of what you list above doesn't interest me.
 
SHUSA said:
what does interest you?
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College basketball, baseball, golf, politics, history, aviation. Losing interest in the first two though. College basketball is going down a bad path and baseball just isn't the same game I grew up playing. Analytics have ruined it.
 
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cernjSHU said:
Well, that is why passing of the infrastructure bill was so needed. Plenty of places where bridges are in disrepair not just NYC. Thankfully Biden was able to get that through.
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Amazing they complain about the bill while still complaining about the poor infrastructure lol.

As if there's ever been a bill not laden with pork. We learned this in high school. Oh vey.
 
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kniespolice said:
Amazing they complain about the bill while still complaining about the poor infrastructure lol.

As if there's ever been a bill not laden with pork. We learned this in high school. Oh vey.
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the infrastructure bill was terrible! biden sucks!

was driving in nyc, the infrastructure sucks!
 
kniespolice said:
Amazing they complain about the bill while still complaining about the poor infrastructure lol.

As if there's ever been a bill not laden with pork. We learned this in high school. Oh vey.
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If you’re referring to me, I never ranted against the infrastructure bill. You’re off your game once again.
 
HALL85 said:
If you’re referring to me, I never ranted against the infrastructure bill. You’re off your game once again.
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No. You were silent on it. Never came out in praise for it either. Yet, in this thread when I posted that why the infrastructure bill was needed and stated thankfully Biden got the bill through, your response was “lol.”

The implication being that either the bill sucked or Biden sucked but clearly commenting with derision to my post.
 
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cernjSHU said:
No. You were silent on it. Never came out in praise for it either. Yet, in this thread when I posted that why the infrastructure bill was needed and stated thankfully Biden got the bill through, your response was “lol.”

The implication being that either the bill sucked or Biden sucked but clearly commenting with derision to my post.
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You’re not good at implying. I didn’t realize I had to give an opinion on every single post. It’s my opinion that important to you?

i’ll help you out here. IMO investment in infrastructure especially is important, something our political leaders should be working on the bipartisan matter and I support it. I also support being fiscally responsible and making those investments at the appropriate time.
 
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