A GIANT Embarrassment

[NYC Pirate]

What the hell?? How can they not take Odell Beckham Jr out of this game. As selfish
a performance as I've seen. Not sure why he's acting like a spoiled brat today.

Anyway The Giants need for this season to end!

 

[TomD82]

What the hell?? How can they not take Odell Beckham Jr out of this game. As selfish
a performance as I've seen. Not sure why he's acting like a spoiled brat today.

Anyway The Giants need for this season to end!

He should have benched his ass at least for a few series.

 

[hallgrad80]

For a coach known as a disciplinarian his handling of ODB today is mystifying .

 

[halltheway]

not so fast

 

[hallgrad80]

Could my Giants follow the script of what my Pirates did yesterday ? One can only hope the Giants defense can get the stop. Well , good comeback but again the defense can't make the end of game stops . Tough game to lose for the Giants like so many this year .

 

[NYC Pirate]

Oh well you take the bad with the good. One of the toughest Giant season to endure as a fan
maybe ever.

I never understand why Coughlin doesn't call timeouts when his defense needs a blow on these
last drives. You are never going to get to use them. You are playing home and that little bit
of rest could make a difference in containment and maybe more line pressure.

Great comeback, one of their best ever, but of course the defense folded again.

No leadership from Coughlin nor Eli with Odell. DRC with unbelievable drop of the INT. The Prince
sucks and Landon Collins is a bull in a China shop.

Washington has to lose both games and the Giants win both. Probably not happening. Reese
has assembled a brutal defensive roster. Coughlin is just too slow on the game management. he prepares them well but not leading enough during the game. Hopefully, McAdoo goes too. His play calling in the first half
is just awful. I do realize that Beckham should have had a TD early.

 

[Piratz]

This is actually an unprecedented season in the history of the NFL. No team has lost games like this.

This damn defense. There we go with guys like Unga and Casillas in big spots again.

 

[NYC Pirate]

This is actually an unprecedented season in the history of the NFL. No team has lost games like this.

This damn defense. There we go with guys like Unga and Casillas in big spots again.

 

[TomD82]

Oh well you take the bad with the good. One of the toughest Giant season to endure as a fan
maybe ever.

I never understand why Coughlin doesn't call timeouts when his defense needs a blow on these
last drives. You are never going to get to use them. You are playing home and that little bit
of rest could make a difference in containment and maybe more line pressure.

Great comeback, one of their best ever, but of course the defense folded again.

No leadership from Coughlin nor Eli with Odell. DRC with unbelievable drop of the INT. The Prince
sucks and Landon Collins is a bull in a China shop.

Washington has to lose both games and the Giants win both. Probably not happening. Reese
has assembled a brutal defensive roster. Coughlin is just too slow on the game management. he prepares them well but not leading enough during the game. Hopefully, McAdoo goes too. His play calling in the first half
is just awful. I do realize that Beckham should have had a TD early.

Maybe instead of giving high 5s to DRC and Prince for the block and recovery of the FG attempt Coughlin should have been getting Beckham to knock it off. Anybody who continues to believe that it is a complete lack of talent for all these losses is clueless.

 

[Piratz]

NYC Pirate, I cannot blame the coaching staff for this, c'mon. Coaches put players in position to make plays.

Catch the TD, OBJ.
Make the pick-6, DRC (just like at Washington)
Make a tackle, Unga.

Make the interception against New England, Collins.
Make the TD catch against New England, OBJ.
Make the FG against the Jets, Josh Brown,

And so on and so forth.

 

[NYC Pirate]

Like I said it started in the first Cowboy game when Coughlin and Spags would not use their timeouts
to get the defense a blow. It can't hurt. These guys in the front are just gassed. NO LB has made a
play in these situations.

Also, it may or may not matter, but then why use your TO's to freeze the kicker and it's never worked. Actually
the adrenalin may work against the kicker if he has to go at a quicker pace. Freezing works in college or
maybe when the weather is an issue.

Bottom line it's an historically awful defense with a dreadful offensive running game. It's that simple.

 

[Piratz]

Like I said it started in the first Cowboy game when Coughlin and Spags would not use their timeouts
to get the defense a blow. It can't hurt. These guys in the front are just gassed. NO LB has made a
play in these situations.

Also, it may or may not matter, but then why use your TO's to freeze the kicker and it's never worked. Actually
the adrenalin may work against the kicker if he has to go at a quicker pace. Freezing works in college or
maybe when the weather is an issue.

Bottom line it's an historically awful defense with a dreadful offensive running game. It's that simple.

NYC, you don't want to take the timeouts on defense for exactly the logic you just mentioned about the kicker. Force the offense to move quickly. Don't allow them to load up. And what would that have proven?

The TO before the FG is not always to "freeze". It's also to give your guys a breather for a good rush. That's different than calling a TO while the offense is moving against you.

The bottom line is the linebackers and safeties are terrible. You'll see the team address that in the offseason.

 

[bd98]

Just glad this miserable season is essentially over. Actually hope the Eagles win tonight to make it 99.99 percent official. Same shit, different week. I'm sick of it. Coughlin is obviously gone. If Reese doesn't go with him it will be years before this team competes again. The lack of talent at pretty much every position on the field is glaringly obvious. So many players who have no business even being in the league are on the field every single play. Not that Coughlin has done a good job because his game management has been horrific but honestly squeezing 6 wins out of this roster is almost miraculous.

Fitting that the season essentially ends the same way it began, with Uani Unga hopelessly lost as he tries to cover a tight end. A 27 year-old undrafted free agent who hasn't played football since 2013 isn't any good? Shocking! Whoever could have foreseen that?

As for the one player on the roster who actually is talented I hope the NFL will suspend Beckham, who showed absolutely no contrition postgame, for next week and I hope the Giants sit him down the week after. Disgraceful. Embarrassing. An insult to the uniform.

 

[Piratz]

The problem now is they're screwed on tie breakers. Need to win out and Redskins lose out to win East at 8-8. That's the only path.

 

[TomD82]

This is actually an unprecedented season in the history of the NFL. No team has lost games like this.

This damn defense. There we go with guys like Unga and Casillas in big spots again.

Casillas was good enough for the Super Bowl Patriots. Unga well like I said the Giants think they can coach anybody up.

The truth is the plays you talk about mask the coaching and how the staff does not know the team. What should have happened was the game ending with a penalty for OBJ kicking the ball a couple of games ago and a 35-14 loss today with him costing his team.

I wonder what patchwork they are going to come up with for the staff again after this 6 win season?

 

[Piratz]

Norman unloading on Beckham in the postgame.

 

[CaptBob]

A real punk attitude, very talented, but a punk none the less. Makes you want to root against him. I guess it's todays 'Look at me" attitude and everyone puts up with it.

 

[hallgrad80]

It's not coaching that has the Giants giving up the most yards on defense.
It's not coaching that has the Giants giving up the most yards defending the pass.
It's not coaching that has the Giants with the second lowest number of sacks this season.
It's the GM and the people that are responsible for the talent on this team that are responsible for those woefull results.

 

[mjs428]

Beckham abused Norman today. Maybe Norman should be fined for his vulgar language.

 

[Piratz]

It's not coaching that has the Giants giving up the most yards on defense.
It's not coaching that has the Giants giving up the most yards defending the pass.
It's not coaching that has the Giants with the second lowest number of sacks this season.
It's the GM and the people that are responsible for the talent on this team that are responsible for those woefull results.

The personnel on defense will be totally overhauled this offseason and that will be the proof on the talent. You have ST players playing defense or guys who would otherwise not be in the league starting at safety. It's terrible.

The offense is fine. A couple of tweaks to the RH side of the line and another option besides OBJ.

 

[Piratz]

Beckham abused Norman today. Maybe Norman should be fined for his vulgar language.

He got open a lot. It'll be more obvious on the film. But Norman got in his head and affected him. A dropped TD pass, 3 personal fouls? Terrible. Out of control.

The refs were a joke too.

 

[Piratz]

I wonder what patchwork they are going to come up with for the staff again after this 6 win season?

This is an interesting point to me. Why is there any talk of firing the HC if you allow him to change coordinators in consecutive seasons? Do they think you chance coordinators and - poof - instantly improve? It's a process. Now change them again? No thanks.

The QB likes the new offense. He's had the best two-year run of his career these two seasons. He's going to be 35 years old. Why change it?

 

[hallgrad80]

The personnel on defense will be totally overhauled this offseason and that will be the proof on the talent.

The offense is fine. A couple of tweaks to the RH side of the line and another option besides OBJ.

Piratz
If you watched the whole game today remember Newton's 40+ run in the first quarter. JPP made an attempt to tackle Cam around his ankle with his injured had and because he doesn't have the ability to use his fingers to hang on Cam broke free and ran for 40. I really hate to say this but that injury has significantly diminished his ability as a player and I don't see him as being a dominant end rusher going forward and that , in my mind, makes the rebuild of the defense even tougher. With needs at DB, linebacker , two end rushers plus help inside it can't be solved in one year.

 

[Piratz]

hallgrad80, I agree. This is not the first time either. He cannot play the run, which used to be a strength. He's grading terribly against the run and with good reason. He cannot properly shed a blocker and forget tackling, especially pulling a QB down if he doesn't hit them square. I give him a lot of credit for coming back and being a presence as a speed rusher, but he's an incomplete football player. He'll have to figure out something this offseason.

You have to focus on one area first. Safety was a problem all offseason and that's where you need to start. Guys like Dahl, Taylor, and Unga cannot see these kind of snap counts. They get exposed every game because they're just not good.

 

[mjs428]

He dropped the Td pass before all the penalties starTed occurring & was open deep but Eli under threw it

 

[TomD82]

Piratz
If you watched the whole game today remember Newton's 40+ run in the first quarter. JPP made an attempt to tackle Cam around his ankle with his injured had and because he doesn't have the ability to use his fingers to hang on Cam broke free and ran for 40. I really hate to say this but that injury has significantly diminished his ability as a player and I don't see him as being a dominant end rusher going forward and that , in my mind, makes the rebuild of the defense even tougher. With needs at DB, linebacker , two end rushers plus help inside it can't be solved in one year.

Yes, it must be the GMs fault that the DE played with fireworks and can't wrap up now. With the talent on this team you would think this team has Miami and Cleveland records and get blown out the majority of games like them. And BTW, Spags knows all about Dahl from the Rams so don't give me this the GM bringing in players the coaches don't want here or shouldn't even be in the league.

If the dam coach knew his defense he would keep them off the field by running and managing the clock which he couldn't do several games.

 

[Piratz]

The only reason the team isn't Cleveland or Miami is because they have Eli Manning and Odell Beckham, Jr. That do covers a lot of mistakes within games. Think back to the win against SF, last week against Miami, etc.

I don't understand how you could hold a coach accountable for 4 consecutive playoff-less years, but not the GM too? Why does Reese get the benefit of the doubt?

 

[TomD82]

The only reason the team isn't Cleveland or Miami is because they have Eli Manning and Odell Beckham, Jr. That do covers a lot of mistakes within games.

I don't understand how you could hold a coach accountable for 4 consecutive playoff-less years, but not the GM too? Why does he get the benefit of the doubt?

I don't have any problem with that. My entire point has always been that with Eli and Beckham this team should be Pittsburgh, Minnesota and even the Jets with a similar record in the thick of things and this division already locked up. One of those teams lost their QB for an extended period another has a losing record as a starter. You just reaffirmed my point. Even the 10-2 record with 75 seconds left secnario affirms that. Thanks.

 

[Piratz]

I don't have any problem with that. My entire point has always been that with Eli and Beckham this team should be Pittsburgh, Minnesota and even the Jets with a similar record in the thick of things and this division already locked up. One of those teams lost their QB for an extended period another has a losing record as a starter. You just reaffirmed my point. Even the 10-2 record with 75 seconds left secnario affirms that. Thanks.

I don't think it's fair to say that. Why? Because football is a game played by individual units who have to perform in situations. You cannot coach around that for an entire season. While the tandem of Eli and OBJ is better than what the Jets or Vikings may put out there or comparable to the Steelers, look at the defensive comparison. Not even close. Those teams are vastly superior on defense, making them overall better even though the Giants may be better in some individual areas.

The Giants are 27th in points allowed. The Jets, Vikings, and Steelers are all top-10. HUGE difference and not enough of a gap for Eli-OBJ to make up alone given the nature of the sport.

It's like having the best lineup in baseball but the worst pitching staff. You end up mediocre. Yes, that stat is great. If we take out other 2-minute stretches when the defense is on the field maybe that'll help too. Obviously.

What makes it worse with the Giants is this nonsense with Coughlin every year. Mara goes out and makes these proclamations in his press conferences for what? Should just say either Tom's the coach and give him the time to rebuild this or he's not. And don't be mistaken, this is a total rebuild with new coordinators, etc. This year-to-year thing makes zero sense, especially with Eli at this stage of his career. A desperate coach cannot bench OBJ today.

 

[hallgrad80]

The Giants lack of talent is not just a figment of imagination dreamed up by disappointed Giants fans. It has been widely acknowledged and discussed exhaustively by a number of the most respected professionals in the sports media that include Bill Polian , a former NFL GM , two former Super Bowl winning coaches in Tony Dungy and Jimmy Johnson, former NFL all pro players like Howie Long and Terry Bradshaw and the list goes on and on and of course the league-wide stats , especially on defense , contribute to that conclusion. The person in the Giants responsible for seeing that the Giants have the talent to win is its GM and that is an inescapable fact.

Has the coaching contributed to this season's unsatisfactory results it has and TC must join JR as the two principals who are most responsible as we're on the precipice of our 4th year in a row w/o making the playoffs and that is also an inescapable fact.

 

[Section112]

They both need to go. Eli can learn a new offense. He's a big boy.

 

[Piratz]

I wouldn't even know where to start with a coach and GM combo. No idea. But it can be done. Heck, look at the Jets this year and the change of direction and approach. Plus the Giants have a ton of cap space.

I hope they win the final two and get to 8-8. Regardless of playoffs or not, at least that would show some progress after consecutive losing years.

If the Eagles defeat the Cardinals tonight it's over. If the Eagles lose, then the Redskins need to lose out (at PHI, at DAL) and the Giants win out (at MIN, PHI).

 

[TomD82]

The Giants lack of talent is not just a figment of imagination dreamed up by disappointed Giants fans. It has been widely acknowledged and discussed exhaustively by a number of the most respected professionals in the sports media that include Bill Polian , a former NFL GM , two former Super Bowl winning coaches in Tony Dungy and Jimmy Johnson, former NFL all pro players like Howie Long and Terry Bradshaw and the list goes on and on and of course the league-wide stats , especially on defense , contribute to that conclusion. The person in the Giants responsible for seeing that the Giants have the talent to win is its GM and that is an inescapable fact.

Has the coaching contributed to this season's unsatisfactory results it has and TC must join JR as the two principals who are most responsible as we're on the precipice of our 4th year in a row w/o making the playoffs and that is also an inescapable fact.

Pollian's article was a joke. He uses one criteria is the HC getting the most out of his ACs. Which DC that he has blown thorough over the years has he gotten the most out of? Sure when there are 3 All Pros that you like to mention so much on the DL including one HOFer. What other coaches has he gotten the most out of? Hufnagel, Tim Lewis, Bill Sheridan and do you want me to go through the special team coaches too? If Whitehead pulled the crap that Beckham did today you guys would crucify Willard. He should have been tossed from the game and there probably would not have been any comeback. Coughlin thought about benching him for at least a few series? And BTW, the Pittsburgh defense stinks.

And that bull crap from Ralph Vacianno when the team is 5-7 nobody expected them to be any good anyway there is no talent. He wouldn't be writing that if they were 8-4 like they should have been. The hypocrisy continues.

 

[Piratz]

TomD, you've been on Coughlin all season long, so who are you hiring as head coach since you want Coughlin out so badly and feel he's held the team back for years?

You must have someone in mind who's better and would have this roster winning immediately next year.

 

[TomD82]

The only reason the team isn't Cleveland or Miami is because they have Eli Manning and Odell Beckham, Jr. That do covers a lot of mistakes within games. Think back to the win against SF, last week against Miami, etc.

I don't understand how you could hold a coach accountable for 4 consecutive playoff-less years, but not the GM too? Why does Reese get the benefit of the doubt?

I am not giving the GM a pass, but, this is ridiculous with this coach and what they have done to accommodate him over the 4 seasons you mention. And his performance as a coach has been putrid in so many areas for these years. If there was such a lack of talent as you describe in this organization the team would be 3-10 like San Diego and they have a QB just about as good as Eli. How are the Texans with JJ Watt, Vince Wolfolk, Foster and Cushing? Are they talented along with #1 overall pick Clowny? Guess what coaching matters big time in this league.

If Mara is really watching what goes on down on the field and Reese is fighting for his job he must be pleading his case asking can't you see what is happening here? Like I said I can't wait until Mara tells the new GM, oh BTW, you don't get to choose the coach to be hired.

 

[Piratz]

You assume Reese would want Coughlin out.

 

[anon_4htvdezyfe7k9]

JPP has not been able to make multiple big plays the last few weeks as a result of the fireworks incident. I respect him for finally addressing what happened in the interview with Strahan today, but it didn't change my opinion of his actions too much.

Wtf obj was thinking today I'll never know. Came across as a petulant child. Hope he's not developing into the TO, "ocho cinco" mold

 

[Piratz]

OBJ was out of control. Should've been put on the bench for a series or two. The refs did nothing, Coughlin did nothing. Of course, Norman has this reputation. He brawled in camp with Cam Newton, once in the past when Steve Smith was on their team too.

And this sh-t show masks what was the biggest comeback in NFL regular season history.

 

[hallgrad80]

The NFL is replete with a long history of owners making all the personnel decisions including hiring the head coach from Paul Brown, to Al Davis to Jerry Jones and of course Tom Coughlin was hand picked by Wellington Mara. Owners have told GM's who they want drafted with their number one pick in the draft and if John Mara is going to pick the next Giant head coach and Tisch agrees that's what happens when you're a team owner and it's not like this is something new or its only Mara who would do this. Who do you think hired Belichick in NE , it was Bob Kraft ,the owner.

 

[bd98]

Damn it Eagles, you had one job...