OT: Need prayers for families impacted by tragedy

[shu09]

This country will never give up their guns, even after 20 little kids were murdered. A huge swath of America bases their lives around their guns (see Christmas cards from certain right wing lunatics). Good luck changing any minds, it's a sad reality.

20 little kids heinously murdered has nothing to do with the second amendment and gun rights in this country. Law abiding gun owners should not be punished for the actions of a crazy man in Connecticut or other demented people who use guns illegally.

The second amendment exists for a reason. While I have never so much as even touched a gun in my life, I respect the right of Americans to own one. The founders of our country put it in place for a reason.

 

[SHUSA]

20 little kids heinously murdered has nothing to do with the second amendment and gun rights in this country. Law abiding gun owners should not be punished for the actions of a crazy man in Connecticut or other demented people who use guns illegally.

The second amendment exists for a reason. While I have never so much as even touched a gun in my life, I respect the right of Americans to own one. The founders of our country put it in place for a reason.

do you think its ok to own assault weapons? then why not artillery? or chemical weapons?

 

[shu09]

do you think its ok to own assault weapons? then why not artillery? or chemical weapons?

No, I don't see the need for someone to own an assault weapon. But once you start restricting then there is a slippery slope. We don't want to end up like Australia or the UK where the citizens don't have gun rights and the police/government can run carte blanche over them as we're seeing these days.

 

[SHUSA]

No, I don't see the need for someone to own an assault weapon. But once you start restricting then there is a slippery slope. We don't want to end up like Australia or the UK where the citizens don't have gun rights and the police/government can run carte blanche over them as we're seeing these days.

i havent really heard about the militant police state in the uk or au. any links? i know aunhad a ton of covid restrictions but that has nothign to do with this

 

[shu09]

Australia Traded Away Too Much Liberty

How long can a democracy maintain emergency restrictions and still call itself a free country?

www.theatlantic.com

Australia's COVID Police State Is Coming To A Country Near You

What was once a liberal democratic society has descended into a full-fledged police state, with Australia returning to its roots as a prison colony.

thefederalist.com

Australia's two largest states trial facial recognition software to police pandemic rules

Australia's two most populous states are trialling facial recognition software that lets police check people are home during COVID-19 quarantine, expanding trials that have sparked controversy to the vast majority of the country's population.

www.reuters.com

Jailed for 51 weeks for protesting? Britain is becoming a police state by stealth | George Monbiot

The government’s back-door amendments to the policing bill are tyrannical. We should be on the streets in our millions, says Guardian columnist George Monbiot

www.theguardian.com

 

[shufan1993]

This country will never give up their guns, even after 20 little kids were murdered. A huge swath of America bases their lives around their guns (see Christmas cards from certain right wing lunatics). Good luck changing any minds, it's a sad reality.

I miss the old Knies!

 

[shu09]

View embedded media

Australia Traded Away Too Much Liberty

How long can a democracy maintain emergency restrictions and still call itself a free country?

www.theatlantic.com

Australia's COVID Police State Is Coming To A Country Near You

What was once a liberal democratic society has descended into a full-fledged police state, with Australia returning to its roots as a prison colony.

thefederalist.com

Australia's two largest states trial facial recognition software to police pandemic rules

Australia's two most populous states are trialling facial recognition software that lets police check people are home during COVID-19 quarantine, expanding trials that have sparked controversy to the vast majority of the country's population.

www.reuters.com

Jailed for 51 weeks for protesting? Britain is becoming a police state by stealth | George Monbiot

The government’s back-door amendments to the policing bill are tyrannical. We should be on the streets in our millions, says Guardian columnist George Monbiot

www.theguardian.com

Aaaaaand crickets from the show your sources brigade!

 

[SHUHoopsFan]

This country will never give up their guns, even after 20 little kids were murdered. A huge swath of America bases their lives around their guns (see Christmas cards from certain right wing lunatics). Good luck changing any minds, it's a sad reality.

There’s no common sense approach, it’s just take everything away now. There’s no way you can have the get out of jail free card for criminals and tell ordinary citizens they can’t own a gun. A lot of things have to be done before you can just take guns out of the hands of good people.

 

[SHUSA]

Aaaaaand crickets from the show your sources brigade!

i genuinely asked because i was curious i wasnt calling you out. i wasnt familiar. i know uk has a lot of mandates and the worker protests. dont know much about uk, which ur links are mostly au.

i wasnt calling you out here. dont be so insecure lol. btw, you ask people for sources just as much as anyone

 

[SPK145]

do you think its ok to own assault weapons? then why not artillery? or chemical weapons?

You do know that the “assault” in the term “assault weapons” refers to cosmetic features not any operational features of the weapon, right?

 

[SHUSA]

You do know that the “assault” in the term “assault weapons” refers to cosmetic features not any operational features of the weapon, right?

actually the us dept of justice has defined it as

"assault weapons are semiautomatic firearms with a large magazine of ammunition that were designed and configured for rapid fire and combat use"

but i guess thats aesthetic

 

[HALL85]

actually the us dept of justice has defined it as

"assault weapons are semiautomatic firearms with a large magazine of ammunition that were designed and configured for rapid fire and combat use"

but i guess thats aesthetic

Have you ever talked tosomeone who owns an “assault weapon” and asked them why?

Maybe we should try to be looking at solutions that’s to help people are dying from gun violence. People like to bring up Sandy Hook all the time. Why? Suburban white middle-class.

Meanwhile, over 530 gun homicides in Philadelphia this year. Most ever. Ever. And the vast majority of them are in minority neighborhoods. Black on black. What would you do to address this alarming number?

Philip Adams diagnosed with CTE as the cause for killing six people. My question, was, what next? Is the NFL cool with that? What would be your solution to prevent that from happening?

Most gun deaths relate back to suicide. I’m going to go out on a limb and suggest very few if any “assault weapons” are used in the commission of a suicide. solution?

I know it’s cool to throw out platitudes and soundbites from the MSM. Cool just doesn’t do it for me.

I find most people I really don’t care about stopping gun violence, because it requires work and some of the solutions don’t fit a narrative that suits them. And now we have actions and rhetoric that are designed to emasculate police forces. Probably why you have a record gun sales over the past decade. Nothing is going to happen.

 

[SHUSA]

Have you ever talked tosomeone who owns an “assault weapon” and asked them why?

Maybe we should try to be looking at solutions that’s to help people are dying from gun violence. People like to bring up Sandy Hook all the time. Why? Suburban white middle-class.

Meanwhile, over 530 gun homicides in Philadelphia this year. Most ever. Ever. And the vast majority of them are in minority neighborhoods. Black on black. What would you do to address this alarming number?

Philip Adams diagnosed with CTE as the cause for killing six people. My question, was, what next? Is the NFL cool with that? What would be your solution to prevent that from happening?

Most gun deaths relate back to suicide. I’m going to go out on a limb and suggest very few if any “assault weapons” are used in the commission of a suicide. solution?

I know it’s cool to throw out platitudes and soundbites from the MSM. Cool just doesn’t do it for me.

I find most people I really don’t care about stopping gun violence, because it requires work and some of the solutions don’t fit a narrative that suits them. And now we have actions and rhetoric that are designed to emasculate police forces. Probably why you have a record gun sales over the past decade. Nothing is going to happen.

people bring up sandy hook because its elementary school kids that went to school to learn abc and got slaughtered. i think that was it.

but youre right. gang on gang violence tends to not be priority. doesnt change the fact assault weapons arent needed. not mutually exclusive. give me one reason why they are needed. according to you, you can kill 530 people and yourself without them. so why are they needed??

 

[HALL85]

people bring up sandy hook because its elementary school kids that went to school to learn abc and got slaughtered. i think that was it.

but youre right. gang on gang violence tends to not be priority. doesnt change the fact assault weapons arent needed. not mutually exclusive. give me one reason why they are needed. according to you, you can kill 530 people and yourself without them. so why are they needed??

Protect your property and family

 

[SHUHoopsFan]

people bring up sandy hook because its elementary school kids that went to school to learn abc and got slaughtered. i think that was it.

but youre right. gang on gang violence tends to not be priority. doesnt change the fact assault weapons arent needed. not mutually exclusive. give me one reason why they are needed. according to you, you can kill 530 people and yourself without them. so why are they needed??

Assault weapons are needed as long as bad dudes possess them. You get them out of the bad guys hands completely, I think it will be a lot easier to get them out of the good guys hands. There’s never been a step by step process of how this gets laid out to ensure people they won’t encounter a bad guy with an assault weapon.

 

[SHUSA]

Protect your property and family

from the other people that have assault weapons?

 

[HALL85]

from the other people that have assault weapons?

You can't be that naïve. You think all the bad guys have legally registered assault weapons? If you owned a family business in Philly and a bunch of looters came through the door, you would want to have the best protection possible. How would you suggest getting assault weapons out of the hands of bad guys?

Can you take a stab at answering the questions I posed above? Or do you prefer this thread turns into another exchange of pithy one-liners that solves absolutely nothing.

 

[SHUSA]

You can't be that naïve. You think all the bad guys have legally registered assault weapons? If you owned a family business in Philly and a bunch of looters came through the door, you would want to have the best protection possible. How would you suggest getting assault weapons out of the hands of bad guys?

Can you take a stab at answering the questions I posed above? Or do you prefer this thread turns into another exchange of pithy one-liners that solves absolutely nothing.

wait i thought the murders in philly werent with assault weapons?

 

[HALL85]

wait i thought the murders in philly werent with assault weapons?

Great, change the subject with a pithy one liner...you are so predictable. When you want to have an actual discussion, come back and we can debate it.

 

[SHUSA]

Great, change the subject with a pithy one liner...you are so predictable. When you want to have an actual discussion, come back and we can debate it.

you actually are changing your points. complete 180 flip flops to support your pov. if you need to retract your previous statememts to make a point then maybe theres something wrong.

perhaps its not as cut and dry as your saying. if you cant even stick to your own points then you have no seat at the table. how can there be a discussion?

talk about predictable.

 

[SHUHoopsFan]

you actually are changing your points. complete 180 flip flops to support your pov. if you need to retract your previous statememts to make a point then maybe theres something wrong.

perhaps its not as cut and dry as your saying. if you cant even stick to your own points then you have no seat at the table. how can there be a discussion?

talk about predictable.

How do you get the assault weapons out of the hands of guys looking to do harm first? Are you willing to potentially have law abiding citizens turn their weapons in while dangerous people don’t show up to turn theirs in and still possess them? I'm not against taking assault weapons off the streets, but the question is about strategy. What well thought out government strategy for safety has worked out well in the last decade? Bloomberg stop and frisk that he apologized for?

 

[HALL85]

you actually are changing your points. complete 180 flip flops to support your pov. if you need to retract your previous statememts to make a point then maybe theres something wrong.

perhaps its not as cut and dry as your saying. if you cant even stick to your own points then you have no seat at the table. how can there be a discussion?

talk about predictable.

<Long answer to essentially say I'm not going to answer> You really don't want to fix the problem.

 

[HALL85]

How do you get the assault weapons out of the hands of guys looking to do harm first? Are you willing to potentially have law abiding citizens turn their weapons in while dangerous people don’t show up to turn theirs in and still possess them? I'm not against taking assault weapons off the streets, but the question is about strategy. What well thought out government strategy for safety has worked out well in the last decade? Bloomberg stop and frisk that he apologized for?

I doubt you will get any real answer to this question but good for you for trying.

 

[SHUHoopsFan]

I doubt you will get any real answer to this question but good for you for trying.

I would assume that means this is a complicated issue that requires a lot of thought and systems in place. The simple answer of get rid of assault rifles isn't so simple and sadly something the government isn't willing to spend it's time on. I guess that's why we address it here piratecrew to solve the world's problems.

 

[HALL85]

I would assume that means this is a complicated issue that requires a lot of thought and systems in place. The simple answer of get rid of assault rifles isn't so simple and sadly something the government isn't willing to spend it's time on. I guess that's why we address it here piratecrew to solve the world's problems.

Yes, it’s cathartic to a degree. Politicians have no interest in solving the problem and there is no public appetite to do the things that have to be done. I asked him to respond to a few simple questions and his head exploded.

 

[SHUHoopsFan]

Yes, it’s cathartic to a degree. Politicians have no interest in solving the problem and there is no public appetite to do the things that have to be done. I asked him to respond to a few simple questions and his head exploded.

I think he's a very intelligent alum. I look forward to his responses as I'm sure they will be well thought out. I'm curious how feasible they will be.

 

[HALL85]

I think he's a very intelligent alum. I look forward to his responses as I'm sure they will be well thought out. I'm curious how feasible they will be.

I’ll look forward to them as well.

 

[SHUSA]

How do you get the assault weapons out of the hands of guys looking to do harm first? Are you willing to potentially have law abiding citizens turn their weapons in while dangerous people don’t show up to turn theirs in and still possess them? I'm not against taking assault weapons off the streets, but the question is about strategy. What well thought out government strategy for safety has worked out well in the last decade? Bloomberg stop and frisk that he apologized for?

according to 85 assault weapons arent in the hands of dangerous people.

 

[HALL85]

according to 85 assault weapons arent in the hands of dangerous people.

More nonsense to avoid discussing. Just means you really don’t care about homicides.

 

[Pirata]

do you think its ok to own assault weapons? then

Actually, assault weapons are banned in the United States unless you apply for a very special permit.

For the record, a semi-automatic AR-15 is not an assault weapon. People who know little to nothing about firearms, let alone military assaults, call it an assault rifle because it fits their agenda and perhaps makes them sound cool and knowledgeable.

There are many reasonable and legitimate reasons to own a legal semi-automatic AR-15. There are no reasonable and legitimate reasons to use one to indiscriminately kill people.

 

[SHUHoopsFan]

according to 85 assault weapons arent in the hands of dangerous people.

I didn't ask you 85's thoughts. So I'll ask again....

How do you get the assault weapons out of the hands of guys looking to do harm first? Are you willing to potentially have law abiding citizens turn their weapons in while dangerous people don’t show up to turn theirs in and still possess them? I'm not against taking assault weapons off the streets, but the question is about strategy. What well thought out government strategy for safety has worked out well in the last decade? Bloomberg stop and frisk that he apologized for?

 

[HALL85]

 

[SHUSA]

Actually, assault weapons are banned in the United States unless you apply for a very special permit.

For the record, a semi-automatic AR-15 is not a assault weapon. People who know little to nothing about firearms, let alone military assaults, call it an assault rifle because it fits their agenda and perhaps makes them sound cool and knowledgeable.

There are many reasonable and legitimate reasons to own a legal semi-automatic AR-15. There are no reasonable and legitimate reasons to use one to kill people.

us dept of justice has defined it as

"assault weapons are semiautomatic firearms with a large magazine of ammunition that were designed and configured for rapid fire and combat use"

 

[SHUSA]

I didn't ask you 85's thoughts. So I'll ask again....

How do you get the assault weapons out of the hands of guys looking to do harm first? Are you willing to potentially have law abiding citizens turn their weapons in while dangerous people don’t show up to turn theirs in and still possess them? I'm not against taking assault weapons off the streets, but the question is about strategy. What well thought out government strategy for safety has worked out well in the last decade? Bloomberg stop and frisk that he apologized for?

the asault weapons are not in the hands. the bad men are not committing murders with assault weapons. so it doesnt matter.

but , im not really opposed to stop and frisk if its not taken advantage of.

 

[Pirata]

us dept of justice has defined it as

"assault weapons are semiautomatic firearms with a large magazine of ammunition that were designed and configured for rapid fire and combat use"

Yes, operative word "defined". Past tense. How about posting the full quote.

A key defining law was the now-defunct Federal Assault Weapons Ban of 1994.[13] At that time, the United States Department of Justice said, "In general, assault weapons are semiautomatic firearms with a large magazine of ammunition that were designed and configured for rapid fire and combat use."


Try this on for size:

Not “assault rifles.” According to the Defense Intelligence Agency, “assault rifles” are “short, compact, selective-fire weapons that fire a cartridge intermediate in power between a submachine gun and rifle cartridges.” All assault rifles are capable of automatic fire. Examples include the U.S. Army M-16, the Soviet AK-47, and the German Sturmgewehr. No guns that are dubbed “assault weapons” are assault rifles—but some of them do look similar, because the small parts that make a gun automatic are internal and not visible.

 

[SHUSA]

Yes, operative word "defined". Past tense. How about posting the full quote.

A key defining law was the now-defunct Federal Assault Weapons Ban of 1994.[13] At that time, the United States Department of Justice said, "In general, assault weapons are semiautomatic firearms with a large magazine of ammunition that were designed and configured for rapid fire and combat use."


Try this on for size:

Not “assault rifles.” According to the Defense Intelligence Agency, “assault rifles” are “short, compact, selective-fire weapons that fire a cartridge intermediate in power between a submachine gun and rifle cartridges.” All assault rifles are capable of automatic fire. Examples include the U.S. Army M-16, the Soviet AK-47, and the German Sturmgewehr. No guns that are dubbed “assault weapons” are assault rifles—but some of them do look similar, because the small parts that make a gun automatic are internal and not visible.

so they changed the definition and made them legal. Now they are just less powerful M16s?

what is the tangible difference?

 

[Pirata]

so they changed the definition and made them legal. Now they are just less powerful M16s?

what is the tangible difference?

The very tangible difference is "selectable" meaning an assault rifle can be switched from semi to full automatic with the flip of a small lever.

A fully automatic weapon fires continuously as long as the trigger is held.

Semi automatics have been legal for years and come in many shapes and sizes. The M1 rifle is a semi. Just as dangerous as the AR 15 Semi but no one talks about those because they are not sexy. A glock is a semi automatic pistol. At close range, just as deadly. Semi automatic shotguns are legal. They are extremely deadly.

The point is, banning semi automatic AR 15s just because the look like a fully automatic version is not going to stop the crazies from killing people.

There are millions of legally owned semi automatic AR15.

 

[SHUSA]

The very tangible difference is "selectable" meaning an assault rifle can be switched from semi to full automatic with the flip of a small lever.

A fully automatic weapon fires continuously as long as the trigger is held.

Semi automatics have been legal for years and come in many shapes and sizes. The M1 rifle is a semi. Just as dangerous as the AR 15 Semi but no one talks about those because they are not sexy. A glock is a semi automatic pistol. At close range, just as deadly. Semi automatic shotguns are legal. They are extremely deadly.

The point is, banning semi automatic AR 15s just because the look like a fully automatic version is not going to stop the crazies from killing people.

There are millions of legally owned semi automatic AR15.

u just said they can be switched to fully automatic

 

[Pirata]

No. I did not say that.

Let's take it from the top.

The US military version of the AR-15 (Armalite AR-15) first made its appearance in Vietnam and was labeled the M16 for the US army.

It has a selector switch on it that allows you to switch from semi to fully automatic modes. It is illegal to own one unless you apply for a very specific permit.

The AR-15 that the public buys is essentially the same weapon but it does not have the selector switch and can only fire in the semi-automatic mode. The gun has been known to be illegally modified to fire and automatic mode. Key word is illegally modified.

There are many variations of the original AR made by many different manufacturers with different numbers. The current Us Army rifle is the M4, which is an updated version of the M16. Very similar but newer technology more reliable, etc.

 

[Pirata]

The point is that there are millions of law abiding AR owners. There's probably something like 100 crazies out there who have used an AR in a mass shooting crime, people want to trample on the law abiding millions.

If you follow that logic then you should also trample on cars, kitchen knives, household chemicals used to make bombs, Budget truck rentals, Tylenol, gasoline, matches, and a host of other things that sick people use to kill other people.