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Pac-12 leaders presented with Apple streaming deal

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Halldan1

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After months of negotiations and uncertainty, Pac-12 commissioner George Kliavkoff on Tuesday presented the conference's presidents and chancellors with a primarily subscription-based Apple streaming deal for its potential television contract that expires after this school year, according to multiple sources.

While several options were presented, the Apple streaming deal emerged as the likely leader at this point, bringing some clarity to a lengthy process that frustrated many within the league and ultimately played a role in Colorado's decision last week to join the Big 12. Monetary and exposure questions still loom, though, and outside pressure from the Big 12 remains.

There's not expected to be any imminent decisions on whether this TV deal is enough to appease Arizona, Arizona State and Utah, which are being heavily courted by the Big 12. The Arizona Board of Regents, which oversees both Arizona and ASU, is scheduled to meet later Tuesday, but no decision is expected Tuesday night after the meeting.

According to sources, the first year of what's expected to be a relatively short-term contract with Apple would start in 2024-25 and begin relatively low to the league's hopes. But the deal, sources said, would incrementally improve and potentially be competitive with its peers in the Big 12 and ACC down the road, provided certain subscription numbers are met.

When the Big 12's new TV deal begins in 2025, those schools will see an increase to an average of $31.7 million. That's long been the barometer at which the Pac-12 deal was expected to be measured.

After the meeting Tuesday morning, there remained ambiguity about the potential value of the Pac-12 deal because of the unknown variance of subscriptions. Sources familiar with the negotiations told ESPN the Pac-12 is in a better position now than it was a month and a half ago to sell digital subscriptions thanks to changes in the media landscape.

Kliavkoff said recently at Pac-12 media days in Las Vegas that the longer the league waited, the better the options became.

"There's an underlying shift in the media market that's happening and we're long term taking advantage of that," he said July 21.

The uncertainty in the Pac-12 has been magnified by the Big 12's unabashed interest in the possibility of further conference expansion and its six-year, $2.2 billion television deal with ESPN and Fox that runs through 2031. The Big 12 opened its negotiations early and completed its agreement before the Pac-12, even though the Pac-12's current television deal ends a year earlier.

The realities of the decision also emerged on campus on Tuesday, as Arizona coach Jedd Fisch addressed local media about the start of training camp and took multiple questions on realignment. Fisch told local reporters that he Zoomed with the families of his players to assure them that clarity on the future would emerge soon. He said a guiding force in the process would be "stability wherever we land."
 
Sounds a lot worse than i thought. I have a feeling all PAC 9 schools are exploring a way out.
 
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I think you read it wrong.
You are right, thanks. Still doesn’t sound like a really great deal though, maybe down the road it gets better but with the better teams looking for a way out it’s doubtful.
 
You are right, thanks. Still doesn’t sound like a really great deal though, maybe down the road it gets better but with the better teams looking for a way out it’s doubtful.
Need to know the specifics. Revenues will be determined by how many fans pony up to subscribe to Apple TV. So all schools will beg their fans to sign up and fork over even more of their cash to sustain their poor business models. When is enough is enough?

And what about the lack of exposure being on a streaming service?
 
Streaming services could actually increase exposure, provided the end user is willing to pay. The customer is not limited to whether or not his cable provider carries a particular Network.
 
Who knows what’s going to happen but it doesn’t look good. And frankly I couldn’t care less. It’s only interesting to me in light of UCONN’s situation. If the PAC 12 implodes and multiple teams head to the B12, does UConn have a landing place there. Despite what CL82 says, the B12 presidents want P5 schools in the west.
 
Who knows what’s going to happen but it doesn’t look good. And frankly I couldn’t care less. It’s only interesting to me in light of UCONN’s situation. If the PAC 12 implodes and multiple teams head to the B12, does UConn have a landing place there. Despite what CL82 says, the B12 presidents want P5 schools in the west.
UConn has hardly been mentioned once in these new reports. I doubt they go anywhere. They’re only our mind because they’re in our conference. Would be shocked if someone like the Big 10 or B12 adds them but maybe the ACC makes a push if they lose big football players like FSU etc.
 
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Sure UConn for Florida State. That’ll make the remaining members happy. The remaining schools will want to keep the $$$ pot all to themselves.
 
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I would watch the ACC with UConn more that Big 12. I don't think anyone CAN leave the ACC now but if other conferences are adding #'s then the ACC might do the same. Plus there are a lot of crappy ACC football teams that would like to take a trip to UConn and get an easy W.
 
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The SEC and B10 are in the drivers seat and will pick off the remaining cream programs and end up with two 20 team leagues and even more of the money.

Just a matter of time.
 
Need to know the specifics. Revenues will be determined by how many fans pony up to subscribe to Apple TV. So all schools will beg their fans to sign up and fork over even more of their cash to sustain their poor business models. When is enough is enough?

And what about the lack of exposure being on a streaming service?
But for schools with options…ie Arizona, State, Oregon, etc., do you take that risk and wait??
 
Who knows what’s going to happen but it doesn’t look good. And frankly I couldn’t care less. It’s only interesting to me in light of UCONN’s situation. If the PAC 12 implodes and multiple teams head to the B12, does UConn have a landing place there. Despite what CL82 says, the B12 presidents want P5 schools in the west.
Well…The Pac 12 (or whatever is left of them) would probably take them…LOL
 
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UConn has hardly been mentioned once in these new reports. I doubt they go anywhere. They’re only our mind because they’re in our conference. Would be shocked if someone like the Big 10 or B12 adds them but maybe the ACC makes a push if they lose big football players like FSU etc.
My feeling is their “name” was being used to get schools they want to move and make a decision.
 
I would watch the ACC with UConn more that Big 12. I don't think anyone CAN leave the ACC now but if other conferences are adding #'s then the ACC might do the same. Plus there are a lot of crappy ACC football teams that would like to take a trip to UConn and get an easy W.
ACC actually makes a lot more sense for them…except monetarily. Higher than the Big East…but not close to the big boys. Question is…does UConn view the ACC as an eventual stepping stone??
 
Not to beat a dead horse but I think UConn eventually finds a home in the ACC. Once FSU, Clemson, Virginia, UNC leave the ACC will need to fill those spots. Uconn, Memphis, etc. will be the schools to fill that void.
 
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Who knows what’s going to happen but it doesn’t look good. And frankly I couldn’t care less. It’s only interesting to me in light of UCONN’s situation. If the PAC 12 implodes and multiple teams head to the B12, does UConn have a landing place there. Despite what CL82 says, the B12 presidents want P5 schools in the west.
Go back and read my posts, I have been pretty consistent about this, and oddly enough, I believe you and I are in agreement on it. Connecticut is in "odd number" add to the big 12. If Colorado is the only Pac 12 addition to the big 12, then Connecticut in as number 14. If Arizona but no other Pac 12 team joins Colorado, we're screwed. And if it ends up being Colorado, Arizona, and Arizona state we're in. If it ends up being Colorado, Arizona, Arizona state, and Utah, which right now is looking pretty likely, we are out.

The good news is that our consolation prize for not getting in is that we get to stay in the big east, which is a great conference from a Connecticut fan perspective despite being a dismal one from a revenue perspective. If we were still in the American and got kicked to the curb at the 11th hour I would be devastated. Being in the Big East… it is disappointing and financially but it leaves us in a position to continue playing teams that we actually care about his fans.

As has always been my position, it's going to be what it's going to be. There's no point in worrying about it one way or the other.
 
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UConn has hardly been mentioned once in these new reports. I doubt they go anywhere. They’re only our mind because they’re in our conference. Would be shocked if someone like the Big 10 or B12 adds them but maybe the ACC makes a push if they lose big football players like FSU etc.
I don't think we meet the parameters for the big 10, as much as I would love to go there. Connecticut is and R1 research institution, but it lacks AAU status. The big 12s interest in us in particularly Bret Yormark interest in us seems to be serious, but the collapse of the Pac 12 makes too many geographically logical schools who are already in the P5 available.

Sucks for us, but it is what it is.
 
Sure UConn for Florida State. That’ll make the remaining members happy. The remaining schools will want to keep the $$$ pot all to themselves.
Lol, well, first FSU isn't going anywhere. If they really believed the GOR was vulnerable, they would be gone today rather than resorting to public temper tantrums as their primary tactic to increase their earnings. That said, in 10 years or so when they actually do leave, the ACC will be grateful to scrape together whatever they can. That is likely to end up being our home. It will be a second or third tier conference, however. Basically, the ACC is going to be "big easted" by ESPN. I find the irony in that satisfying.

For what it's worth, if I was the ACC commissioner, I would call their bluff and tell them to either submit their withdrawal paperwork or quit their whining. I if they actually did try to withdraw, and were successful, the ACC would get an immediate influx of a half billion dollars, or perhaps more. That should be enough to satisfy the remaining teams for the rest of the GOR.
 
I would watch the ACC with UConn more that Big 12. I don't think anyone CAN leave the ACC now but if other conferences are adding #'s then the ACC might do the same. Plus there are a lot of crappy ACC football teams that would like to take a trip to UConn and get an easy W.
Our opening game this season is NC State. They beat us handily last year. It will be a good measuring stick for the program. I'm hopeful that it will be a competitive game.
 
Well…The Pac 12 (or whatever is left of them) would probably take them…LOL
Sadly, that might not be the worst idea for football only. It's only six trips out to the coast and even that pitiful Apple deal with top the half million a year we get in broadcast rights for our football games. Unfortunately, I think NCAA rules would require us to join for all sports, which would be a nonstarter.
 
ACC actually makes a lot more sense for them…except monetarily. Higher than the Big East…but not close to the big boys. Question is…does UConn view the ACC as an eventual stepping stone??
Probably yes, mostly because it is likely to break up when their GOR lapses in 2036.
 
UCONN has already given up approx. $9 million by being in the Big East the last 2 years.
 
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UCONN has already given up approx. $9 million by being in the Big East the last 2 years.
How do you figure? The American deal is an average worth just under 7 million dollars per school per year. The big east makes about 4 1/2 million dollars per school per year. Connecticut saves about $2 million per year in travel costs by being in the big east. Connecticut has a separate television deal with CBS Sportsnet to broadcast it home football games worth about a half million a year.

So...
$7.00M
- 4.50M
- 2.00M
- 0.50M

- 0.00 -

I can't remember whether the Big East retains the money from Connecticut's deal with SNY to broadcast women's basketball games, but if not, then that's another 1.5 million to Connecticut.

Plus, being an independent lets us schedule at least one "pay game" a year that are currently worth between 1.5 and $2 million annually.

Being in the big east is actually more profitable to us on a net basis.
 
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Cool, I'm interested in hearing how he comes up with them. Take a look at my edited post above for how I think the math shakes out.
Didn't mean to impune your data in any way. But having seen SPK's previous posts on college sports financial stuff it's been clear that he is very very knowledgable on the subject. All wet on matters political but very sharp on the financials.
 
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Difficult to quantify things like this, but there is a value directly attributable to UConn basketball that wasn’t there when playing in the American.

For example, UConn likely saw an increase in donations, memorabilia sales, etc. directly following the national championship. It’s speculative but reasonable to assume they weren’t winning the championship in the American.
 
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Seems like you (and almost everyone else) focuses solely on the media deal revenue without taking into account conference expenses.

All actual figures:

2021 Average Full AAC share = $8,018,565
2022 Average Full AAC share = $8,539,198
Total Full Share for the 2 Years = $16,557,763

2021 UCONN BE share = $3,040,423
2022 UCONN BE share = $4,297,595
Total Full Share for the 2 Years = $7,338,018

UCONN Loss of Revenue = $9,219,745

And that doesn't include UCONN's $17 million AAC exit fee or their $3.5 million BE entrance fee.
 
Difficult to quantify things like this, but there is a value directly attributable to UConn basketball that wasn’t there when playing in the American.

For example, UConn likely saw an increase in donations, memorabilia sales, etc. directly following the national championship. It’s speculative but reasonable to assume they weren’t winning the championship in the American.
Defintely true but to the extent of their conference lost revenue/exit fees?
 
I apologize if this is a silly question, but if UConn's football TV deal is worth $500K why is ESPN/FOX willing to pay an additional $31M to Big12 for the addition of UConn?
 
Difficult to quantify things like this, but there is a value directly attributable to UConn basketball that wasn’t there when playing in the American.

For example, UConn likely saw an increase in donations, memorabilia sales, etc. directly following the national championship. It’s speculative but reasonable to assume they weren’t winning the championship in the American.
Well, except that we did win a championship in the American. Otherwise, though, I absolutely agree.
 
I apologize if this is a silly question, but if UConn's football TV deal is worth $500K why is ESPN/FOX willing to pay an additional $31M to Big12 for the addition of UConn?
I don't think it's a dumb question, I think it's an incomplete one. Arguably what you want to say is if Connecticut is currently getting 4.5 million in the Big East and another half million from CBS Sportsnet, then isn't there value only $5 million. That's not an unfair statement. Of course by the same logic the Big East should get an increase in its next contract because we only make 4 1/2 million per school now so that's our value.

The argument, as I understand it is that we are additive to the big 12 because we extend their presence into the New York metro area in the East Coast. Our men's basketball is indisputably the best in the country over the past quarter century and the women's basketball program is historic in terms of what it has achieved. Football is coming off a 10 year historical run of suck, but BY has commented that he thinks we have the right guy in place to correct it in believes that will happen prior to the next big 12 contract. He came to Storrs and toured the facilities and understands that we never gave up on football. Our facilities are already say upper 25% in the P5. Yormark also thinks that basketball has been dramatically undervalued for years. He is planning on splitting the football and basketball contracts during their next negotiation. He believes that that will result in a significantly higher value than selling them on a combined basis. With the addition of UConn he has the immediate three pass national champions in men's basketball in the best men's and women's combo in the country. Before you say no one cares about women's basketball, BY specifically mentioned our program and its strength as being additive to the big 12 which already has decent women's basketball.

So given all of that, why aren't we a sure thing? Well, if the scuttlebutt is to be believed the big 12 presidents had some reluctance of bringing in a notoriously weak football school and particularly one located on the east coast. Ultimately, they have the decision, but given Yormark's track record it is reported that he has considerable sway among the presidents.

That's the current status as I understand it.
 
Well, except that we did win a championship in the American. Otherwise, though, I absolutely agree.
Yes, but that championship wasn't as a long-standing member of the American. That was the final hurrah of a team consisting of BigEast holdovers. Again, it's speculative but it's reasonable to assume that level of success was not sustainable in the American. The macro results indicate that UConn wasn't too big to fail...it wasn't until the return to the BigEast that they returned to elite status. Coincidence? maybe, maybe not.
 
Seems like you (and almost everyone else) focuses solely on the media deal revenue without taking into account conference expenses.

All actual figures:

2021 Average Full AAC share = $8,018,565
2022 Average Full AAC share = $8,539,198
Total Full Share for the 2 Years = $16,557,763

2021 UCONN BE share = $3,040,423
2022 UCONN BE share = $4,297,595
Total Full Share for the 2 Years = $7,338,018

UCONN Loss of Revenue = $9,219,745

And that doesn't include UCONN's $17 million AAC exit fee or their $3.5 million BE entrance fee.
It seems that you, like pretty much everyone else, are focusing solely conference revenue. In order to do an examination of the fiscal impact you also have to look at the reduction of expense. Particularly, in this case the savings of about $2 million per year in travel expenses. Likewise, you need to consider earnings from the sale of the broadcast rates for Connecticut's football home games. Those two items alone would cut the differential in half

On the big east side it doesn't seem to include NCAA tournament credits? It looks too low for that. Also, just curious, why was there a reduced share for Connecticut in 2021? I'm not doubting your figures, I'm just curious.

Other things to consider would include additional sales of merchandise, the renegotiation of our Nike and LeerField deals and additional ticket sales due to being in the Big East.
 
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Yes, but that championship wasn't as a long-standing member of the American
OK, should we also discount last year's national championship because it wasn't as a "long-standing member" of the new Big East? I'd be OK with that because then we would get to keep our last year's NCAA revenue.
Again, it's speculative but it's reasonable to assume that level of success was not sustainable in the American. The macro results indicate that UConn wasn't too big to fail...it wasn't until the return to the BigEast that they returned to elite status. Coincidence? maybe, maybe not.
agree that it is speculative. I am the first person to say that being in the big east conference helps us as a basketball program. It reminds people of our glory years and certainly, for East Coast kids at least, the biggest has a certain panache about it. That said, the biggest difference between our down years in the American and our current success is due to Seton Hall's own Dan Hurley. A considerable part of our struggles in the American we're due to the fact that after Ollie won the national championship, he pretty much started phoning it in. That's not Dan Hurley. I don't think that Guy has an off switch.

So, does Hurley win a national championship in the American? Who knows? I definitely think it was easier to do in the Big East though.
 
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