Remember Party over Country
- Thread starter NYShoreGuy
- Start date
Party over country, sounds like making a display by ripping up a state of the union speech.
But NYSG claims to be nonpartisan....LMAO
Biggest tool on this board. I think worse than BS. Talk about the ladies of CNN and he'll get right back at you with 10 posts in 20 seconds. Don't mess with his media folk. But ask him what's the difference between a business man being president and having debt and a politician owing people for taking tens and hundreds of millions in the form of campaign contributions, he goes missing.
You are not serious about this are you? Hmm. Do you really need to be explained the difference which is so obvious?
100% serious. Are you a man of principle or not? If the principle is the president owes someone what's the difference if it's debt or it's favors. The debt has a limit of $900 mil for Trump. What's the limit in favors Biden will owe? How much has Michelle Obama's decision to stop her eating healthy campaign because the food lobbyists threw money to stop it? If you truly believe government initiatives can make a difference, how many people have pre-existing conditions because that initiative was shut down? How many less people would've had pre-existing conditions at the start of Covid? Cost of favors can be really high.
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I am nonpartisan, why have the republicans taken a hard line stance the last 10 weeks? I was never in favor of 600 dollar giveaway each week but then it stopped after x amount of weeks as one party felt everything could go right back to normal. I am in favor of stimulus but 1 time 1200 dollars for a good chunk of population was not good enough. Both sides have made this be a squabble right as election season turns the corner to election day. Shame on both sides.
Sorry this is a ridiculous stance. The debt never goes away and it keeps getting higher with interest. It effects your business and you personally for as long as that debt lasts which could cripple a person and make a person desperate to get out from under it. Debt is a huge contributor to crime, whether it be financial crimes, fraud or street crime burglary and robbery. Campaign donations are donations. You do not pay back. What is the worst thing that could happen? You do not get re-elected? Many people donate to campaigns and if large enough it may influence policy. So there is no equivalence here at all and the suggestion that it is equivalent is intellectually and factually dishonest.
Btw, I have no idea what you are talking about Michelle Obama's decision to stop her eating healthy campaign.She is no longer the First Lady. I know that Trump stopped her initiatives. So, if Trump stopped her initiatives, then isn't he the one who made people's condition worse?
I can't believe you are naive enough to think these major donors don't get favors in return. No point in continuing to debate if you think donors get nothing in return. Maybe if you donate a million dollars to seton hall you'll get the same treatment as those who donate $10.
Food Lobbyists water down Michelle Obama's plan.
https://archive.thinkprogress.org/h...elle-obamas-let-s-move-campaign-85d09b60607b/
Exactly. Desperation is the difference.
How much of an issue would it be for Trump if his lenders said they will not extend the maturity?
Considering how US banks wouldn't lend to Trump, and given that large office buildings and hotels are not exactly a hot commodities right now... What would Trump be willing to do to save his brand if that happens?
There is a risk there which has not existed with any other president and we don't really know how much of a risk it is.
No use debating is correct. You are trying to equate the two. There is not even a close equivalency. But for argument's sake, let's say that they are. Every campaign donation is of public record and you can see who gave and how much to which candidate. If you say that is equivalent, why can't we see those records of what debt Trump owes personally and in his companies?
I have no problems with that. Just like I have no problem with finding if any federal politician or their families are making money off foreign deals
2 sides can play party over country.
https://money.yahoo.com/video/why-nancy-pelosi-may-acting-171739362.html
https://money.yahoo.com/video/why-nancy-pelosi-may-acting-171739362.html
Mitt Romney didn’t vote for Trump. That’s putting country before party. He is just one of many important Republicans but he is probably the most high profile elected official Good for you Mitt!
Which Dem goes against his/her party? Joe Manchin? Only does it because he knows he could lose his job.
This is the first time in history that so many high ranking Politicians are abandoning their own party for the good of the country. The Bush family, McCain family, former RNC Steele aré all not voting for Trump and some are voting Biden. Murkowski I think will not vote for Trump, also see the Lincoln project. Should tell you that a vote for Trump is voting against the country.
As far as voting in Congress, politicians cross party occasionally ie manchin. But he will be voting Biden. If anyone was a John McCain admirer, I can’t see how you can vote for Trump.
It tells me that a vote for Trump is a vote against the establishment. They have dug in for four years and are now going for the jugular. It's their best chance to get him out.
Wow.
It should tell you how bad Trump is that good and respectable Republicans will vote against Trump. It should make you think back to a Time when Alexander Hamilton threw his support over to His hated rival Thomas Jefferson to be President over Aaron Burr becáuse he knew Burr was garbage and bad for the country.
if you think the establishment is against him, Trump’s own people are now not supporting him like General Mattis , Kelly, John Bolton and Scaramuccio. People who have worked with him closely are now saying he is unfit to be President.
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You’re not helping your case when you reference Bolton and Scaramucci. Just saying.
The reality is both parties created the opportunity for someone like Trump to win the presidency. And considering he is still within striking distance to win a second term that tells you that Democrats and Republicans haven’t learned their lesson.
Trump is a problem but these politicians that have taken no responsibility are deflecting what the real issue is. McMaster is a pretty good read on this.
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McMaster would not and directly say he is not voting for him but the clear indication is that he is against Trump and will not vote for him.
My point was that McMaster has been very public with the underlying problems of our political system And that is a much bigger issue than Trump.
McMaster wants Trump out of office and that is pretty clear. The amount of excuse making, defending the indefensible is incredible to me. Make no mistake Trump is the biggest danger there is to this country. Not the political norms that has steered this country for so long. This country may not get it right at the time all the time. But it constantly improves from mistakes. Time to correct another mistake and remove this vile, uncouth, despicable fraud from the hallowed halls of the White House.
Sure, ignore my point. And ignore McMasters point as well.
McMaster wants Trump out of office and that is pretty clear. The amount of excuse making, defending the indefensible is incredible to me. Make no mistake Trump is the biggest danger there is to this country. Not the political norms that has steered this country for so long. This country may not get it right at the time all the time. But it constantly improves from mistakes. Time to correct another mistake and remove this vile, uncouth, despicable fraud from the hallowed halls of the White House.
This is not a Republican OR Democrat issue. It is a Republican AND Democrat issue. All you need to do is look at how the Senate and House have voted over the last 15-20 years vs before.....but Trump...lol
Kanye is anti-establishment.
Trump is just different establishment and anyone who disagrees with him is forced out.
Meadows, Ratcliff, Mnuchin, Pompeo, DeVos, Chao, Wolf... These are not exactly anti-establishment people. They are just the ones who haven't challenged Trump enough to be fired yet.
Wait, what?? All of these republicants were previously excoriated by the dems and the media (but I repeat myself) and now they are "good and respectable", LOL?
They are putting their hatred of Trump above everything else, not country before party. That's plain to see. I get it but patronizing them now doesn't change the past.
Just too funny.
The hypocrisy by both parties gets worse by the day. Utah's politicians working together is more of the model that this country needs.
Trump is a puzzling case study in many ways and has encouraged his detractors who still haven't admitted they screwed up the last election by pushing Hillary to the top, who so many universally hated. Trump didn't learn from that and has shot himself in the foot before and during this election season and has become the hated one due to his ongoing ridiculous tweets, his inability to keep a consistent focused white house staff and cabinet, and most of all his bad handling of the health crisis and racial issues. He has missed the opportunity Covid actually gave him by speaking plainly to the American people and trying to unite people during this crisis - totally missed that opportunity because he is more focused on how he been wronged and on his reelection campaign (like so many politicians before him even though he claims he is not one of those).
The MSM and various government factions have been on a tear to get him out since the day he won and that has proven to be something he has not handled well at all to say the least. He has handled the economy better than any President I have seen in years and Mnunchen has a lot to do with that. He is the only President who has helped small businesses going back to the Reagan era. Most Presidents say they help small businesses by making SBA loans available and doing little more but this President has done a ton for small business from the tax code changes to the wildly successful PPP program which no one is talking about. That has created and kept millions of jobs. He also hasn't gotten us into any wars and in fact has pulled more troops out of harms way than he has sent in going against the powerful military establishment, even though he is widely criticized for being crazy (due to his ridiculous tweets and comments). He is a puzzling guy in so many ways not to mention the orange complexion. Many of his problems he brought on himself.
His lack of keeping the adults on his staff has been his biggest downfall and retaining people who can get in his face and say no that is not allowed or legal or let's take a different approach etc. And every time he kicks another staff member to the curb the new one has to come in and get up to speed. That is no way to run a country. And he has surrounded himself with some very questionable characters too including his son-in-law. With that said, no President in my time has faced the backlash he faced since the beginning but frankly he has not handled it well. And when Mattis and Kelly walked, I knew his Presidency was in trouble long before he handled Covid so badly. For all those reasons I think he is not electable and he brought a lot of trouble on himself in spite of many of the positive things that have come out of his tenure (economy, taxes, jobs, way better handling of China and calling certain things out that needed to be called out). People don't pay attention to the issues as much as they have paid attention to his ridiculous rhetoric and he reinforced that on the debate stage instead of focusing on the good things he did (another missed opportunity for him). I cannot elect him President and it is time for him to go. I am less worried about Biden who I believe is a moderate than I am about Harris who is clearly a politician who will say anything and do anything to get elected. She has changed her stripes in mid sentence and is consistently inconsistent and the more I hear her the less impressed I am and its got nothing to do with the fact she is a woman or her race. This will be interesting and I hope Biden stays healthy and the Repubs hold the Senate to create balance. Trump has lost his swing voters and many women and some men. I am not influenced as much by the polls as I am the general agreement that he is universally disliked and that is what loses elections as we saw last time around. He will lose for all those reasons and he has no one to blame but himself.
Trump is a puzzling case study in many ways and has encouraged his detractors who still haven't admitted they screwed up the last election by pushing Hillary to the top, who so many universally hated. Trump didn't learn from that and has shot himself in the foot before and during this election season and has become the hated one due to his ongoing ridiculous tweets, his inability to keep a consistent focused white house staff and cabinet, and most of all his bad handling of the health crisis and racial issues. He has missed the opportunity Covid actually gave him by speaking plainly to the American people and trying to unite people during this crisis - totally missed that opportunity because he is more focused on how he been wronged and on his reelection campaign (like so many politicians before him even though he claims he is not one of those).
The MSM and various government factions have been on a tear to get him out since the day he won and that has proven to be something he has not handled well at all to say the least. He has handled the economy better than any President I have seen in years and Mnunchen has a lot to do with that. He is the only President who has helped small businesses going back to the Reagan era. Most Presidents say they help small businesses by making SBA loans available and doing little more but this President has done a ton for small business from the tax code changes to the wildly successful PPP program which no one is talking about. That has created and kept millions of jobs. He also hasn't gotten us into any wars and in fact has pulled more troops out of harms way than he has sent in going against the powerful military establishment, even though he is widely criticized for being crazy (due to his ridiculous tweets and comments). He is a puzzling guy in so many ways not to mention the orange complexion. Many of his problems he brought on himself.
His lack of keeping the adults on his staff has been his biggest downfall and retaining people who can get in his face and say no that is not allowed or legal or let's take a different approach etc. And every time he kicks another staff member to the curb the new one has to come in and get up to speed. That is no way to run a country. And he has surrounded himself with some very questionable characters too including his son-in-law. With that said, no President in my time has faced the backlash he faced since the beginning but frankly he has not handled it well. And when Mattis and Kelly walked, I knew his Presidency was in trouble long before he handled Covid so badly. For all those reasons I think he is not electable and he brought a lot of trouble on himself in spite of many of the positive things that have come out of his tenure (economy, taxes, jobs, way better handling of China and calling certain things out that needed to be called out). People don't pay attention to the issues as much as they have paid attention to his ridiculous rhetoric and he reinforced that on the debate stage instead of focusing on the good things he did (another missed opportunity for him). I cannot elect him President and it is time for him to go. I am less worried about Biden who I believe is a moderate than I am about Harris who is clearly a politician who will say anything and do anything to get elected. She has changed her stripes in mid sentence and is consistently inconsistent and the more I hear her the less impressed I am and its got nothing to do with the fact she is a woman or her race. This will be interesting and I hope Biden stays healthy and the Repubs hold the Senate to create balance. Trump has lost his swing voters and many women and some men. I am not influenced as much by the polls as I am the general agreement that he is universally disliked and that is what loses elections as we saw last time around. He will lose for all those reasons and he has no one to blame but himself.
And here you are, once again, defending and deflecting on behalf of the indefensible. Yet, you’ll continue to question the objectivity and partisanship of others while doing the exact same thing over and over and over again. Good for you.
Life would be so much easier for republicans if they can defend and deflect the indefensible with "Russian interference" every damn time. It must be Putin.
Perfectly said on everything, the good, bad and the ugly.
Mic drop for Section112, you should write a daily/weekly column for a respectable news source except there are no more respectable news sources any more.
If I ever need a whatabout that makes no sense at all, I know where to find you.
Ditto on the mic drop for 112.
On the news sources, I have gravitated to News Nation (which I posted about a month or so ago). It's on WGN America and is as straight down the middle as you will find. People complain about the new sources, but too many love to live in their echo chambers....just look at this board.
It is not patronizing at all. You can have honest differences of opinions about policy. But I sure in hell didn't have anything personal against those republicans. As a mater of fact, I voted for McCain and I admired him. To think they are not supporting Trump out of pure personal feelings of hatred of Trump is purely mistaken and wrong. Yes, Steve Schmidt, Mitt Romney are perfectly respectable men. Once McCain died, any thought of the elected Republican party in Congress standing up for what is right died with John McCain.
So SPK, in your view point, John McCain just hated Trump out of personal feelings and not for the love of country?
Maybe you didn't have any personal animosity towards them but the media and dems in general sure did only to change their tune now that its politically advantageous for them. Hypocrites.
McCain became a nasty man and terrible candidate in 2008.
Yes, McCain hated Trump more for personal reasons and rightly so. Remember his last shameful act of campaigning against Obamacare only to vote not to dismantle it and then do that that ridiculously embarassing thumbs-up moment. That was personal.
Didn't McCain also advance the acceptance of the Steele Dossier? That had to create some serious animosity between he and Trump. So yeah I think it was personal for both men.