Trump Korean Summit
- Thread starter cernjSHU
- Start date
I want to treat people fairly but like Steve said we can't take in everyone. And right now those governments (Mexico, El Salvador, Guatemala etc.) have no need to try and fix the cartels and smugglers because they are making money on them and we are taking many of illegals in - essentially we are enablers. Why would the goverments ever stop that flow of illegals if they are profiting from it? They don't care about the people at all and have proven that many times.
But stop or slow their ability to come in illegally and you shut down their money making operation and then you have some real change. It has to be done at some point so we can have a more orderly system of immigration into the US. I don't believe in separating the families from the parents but the numbers are increasing and the problem just keeps getting bigger every day.
But stop or slow their ability to come in illegally and you shut down their money making operation and then you have some real change. It has to be done at some point so we can have a more orderly system of immigration into the US. I don't believe in separating the families from the parents but the numbers are increasing and the problem just keeps getting bigger every day.
I see your point based on the wording of the Affirmative asylum process. I think you also have to look at the Defensive asylum processes which is on the same page you linked. That seems to be the process that they are operating under.
This link explains it a bit. https://immigration.findlaw.com/asy...cations-vs-defensive-asylum-applications.html
"Individuals are generally placed into Defensive asylum processing in one of two ways:·
- They are referred to an Immigration Judge by USCIS after they have been determined to be ineligible for asylum at the end of the affirmative asylum process, or
- They are placed in removal proceedings because they:
- Were apprehended (or caught) in the United States or at a U.S. port of entry without proper legal documents or in violation of their immigration status,
OR - Were caught by U.S. Customs and Border Protection (CBP) trying to enter the United States without proper documentation, were placed in the expedited removal process, and were found to have a credible fear of persecution or torture by an Asylum Officer. See Questions & Answers: Credible Fear Screenings for more information on the Credible Fear Process."
- Were apprehended (or caught) in the United States or at a U.S. port of entry without proper legal documents or in violation of their immigration status,
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Right. It is all in the intent of this administration.
They block you from entering the US and requesting asylum. They want you to come in illegally to request asylum because then they can prevent you from getting asylum.
Those who enter the US illegally to request asylum are now charged with entering the US illegally (new zero tolerance policy). We tell them they can see their kids again if they plea guilty. Then they can request asylum afterwards and their chances are severely diminished because they pleaded guilty to entering the US illegally.
I'm not quite sure where you're getting your scenario from.
I do know that if you show up at a Port of Entry you can initiate the Affirmative Asylum procedure. I also know there is a tremendous backlog on that and that you will have to wait but if you go that route you will not be separated from your family.
I do not believe the administration is doing anything to discourage people from doing this.
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There currently is no limit. It is judged based on criteria to prove a well founded fear of persecution.
"Affirmative requests for asylum of individuals from Guatemala, El Salvador, and Honduras have increased by 25 percent in fiscal year 2017 compared to 2016."
https://www.wola.org/analysis/fact-sheet-united-states-immigration-central-american-asylum-seekers/
No unfortunately the media doesn't report facts. So I have no clue of what's been going on at the border the last 5 years, what kind of contributions these people are making to our society, what the positive and negative consequences of putting a number on things does.
I'm sorry, I was unclear. I am not asking for how many do we allow in. I am asking your opinion as to how many we SHOULD let in.
EDIT - To further clarify - immigration is a multi pronged issue, so my question more precisely, regardless of policy mechanisms, how many people should the US allow to immigrate per year?
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Very complex discussion.
Take a gander at the entire article and see if that gives you a start.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Immigration_to_the_United_States
I think giving a random opinion without anything to back up and support my opinion is a waste of my time and your time. If I said 5 people it would be argued, if I said 500,000,000 it would be argued. Like I said I don't know the positive and negative impacts of what each number would do to our country.
We are not the only ones with this problem.
https://www.cnn.com/2018/06/18/europe/merkel-seehofer-migration-intl/index.html
Germany's Merkel given ultimatum by interior minister over migration policy
https://www.cnn.com/2018/06/18/europe/merkel-seehofer-migration-intl/index.html
Germany's Merkel given ultimatum by interior minister over migration policy
Children who are being smuggled or otherwise exploited is obviously bad and yes, I do have compassion for them. What I don't have is the resources to solve all the problems facing us. I don't see how separating them from the smugglers does much for the children one way or the other. We can't keep them so they must be sent back. We can feel good that we separated them from bad people but if we send them back to their home country we are not solving the problem. They return to the same conditions that allowed them to be exploited in the first place.
Separating the families does virtually nothing to help the 83% of truly at risk children while making the lives of the other 17% worse. I believe it needs to stop.
What's sad is the republicans and democrats can't come together to solve this. Neither side is willing to work with the other. Nobody on either side does the right thing, they do what's best for their agenda. It just goes to show the people in charge are disgusting and every vote is not for the best candidate it's for the lesser evil.
That's true, but it also reflects the state of the country. People with opposing viewpoints can no longer sit down and have a conversation. It just turns into a screaming match.
Society has really gone downhill over the years, specifically the last 10.
Just about the time “social” media exploded. We have all these great waya to communicate, but we don’t communicate.
Social media is a net negative. Plenty of good things, but too many bad things. As time moves forward, more and more people will long for the days before it. Unfortunately, the toothpaste is already out of the tube.
I also shake my head at what seems to be the explosion of four letter words in regular conversation. Maybe it's just me but the increased acceptance of these words in regular discourse is something that really bothers me. It seems that only in the last few years have they been normalized through the internet (social media, blogs, even magazine and news articles). This board isn't innocent either, I've seen them plenty of times on here.
Dinner conversation:
Then again, every generation has it's downside. I try to avoid becoming my parents who provided endless reminiscences about things in the past. My childhood was different than theirs. My daughter's childhood was different from mine. Her kid's childhoods will be different than hers......and on and on.
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If you want to get really jacked up about a dismal future, then go rent "Soylent Green"(1973, Charlton Heston, Edward G. Robinson)
Here is the scene where Sol (EGR) decides to pack it in. If you have not seen the film, the images during the euthanasia are from his youth and have long disappeared from the earth.
An interesting thing is to read the comments posted on Youtube about this scene.
Here is the scene where Sol (EGR) decides to pack it in. If you have not seen the film, the images during the euthanasia are from his youth and have long disappeared from the earth.
An interesting thing is to read the comments posted on Youtube about this scene.
What a mess.
630 including 100 unaccompanied children refused entry by Italy and Malta.
"Due to their ordeal, the migrants from the Aquarius have been granted special authorization to remain in Spain for 45 days before they must begin resolving their legal situation.
We have to strike a balance between our sensibilities and humanity and our respect for the law," said Spain's migration minister, Magdalena Valerio.
These people could not be left adrift in the Mediterranean, where they would face death," she told Spanish radio Cope. "(The EU) must recognize that it needs an immigration policy that these times require."
https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/6553663/migrants-aquarius-ship-dock-spain-refused-entry-italy-malta/
630 including 100 unaccompanied children refused entry by Italy and Malta.
"Due to their ordeal, the migrants from the Aquarius have been granted special authorization to remain in Spain for 45 days before they must begin resolving their legal situation.
We have to strike a balance between our sensibilities and humanity and our respect for the law," said Spain's migration minister, Magdalena Valerio.
These people could not be left adrift in the Mediterranean, where they would face death," she told Spanish radio Cope. "(The EU) must recognize that it needs an immigration policy that these times require."
https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/6553663/migrants-aquarius-ship-dock-spain-refused-entry-italy-malta/
Looks like you're on your own in this one, Spike. Your usual cast of assenters aren't going for the ride with you.
Indeed it was - thought it was a facility for children who arrived unaccompanied.
We did not have a zero tolerance policy where we charged parents and separated children - unless we believed the child was in danger or if appeared to be trafficking.
There was an intentional change in policy as a deterrent, and thankfully Trump is changing course because of the political pressure.
Maybe not zero-tolerance but depending on the actuation, parents were charged in that time-frame and the kids were separated and put in "cages". The big difference was that there was no outrage, at least not by Whoopi or Behar. lol.
From what I have read, it was something that was rare - and after the policy change this year, we separated more families in 6 weeks than we did in multiple years. Congress directed ICE in 2005 to try and keep families together.
That is why we saw the outrage now... and the outrage worked.
That's bit of a BS response. You're basically saying confining kids is okay as long as you don't do it too often.
Accordingly I guess murder is okay as long as you don't do it too much.
Nonetheess I credit Trump with having the courage to bring it to a head and ending it. He solved the problem that the swamp couldn't
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You are congratulating Trump for having the courage to change a policy that his administration created? Seriously?
It was a NEW policy which began in May 2018. His administration created this. How do you not see that?
This is new... It was an INTENTIONAL decision to separate ALL families as a deterrent instead of a unintended consequence in some cases previously.
If you don't get that, pretend it was a policy decision by the Obama administration.
The law was put in place under Bush 43. It was enforced by Obama for 8 years. Trump's zero tolerance became a left talking point. And combined it brought the problem to a head. The lefts hatred of Trump has helped in solving this problem. However I could probably find 10 links of articles or YouTube clips of Obama himself talking about separating families and it's not the President's job to create laws, it's his job to see laws are executed. You can go back and find these children we're living in cages the same way back in 2012 as they are now. The change is not as big as everyone makes it out to be from Obama to Trump. Trump is the President now so it's currently his problem to deal with, but where was the outrage when this was going on the last 10 years? All the politicians left and right should be ashamed it took 10 years to call this out. That's at minimum 9.5 year of incompetence. They should all be held accountable.
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https://www.factcheck.org/2018/06/did-the-obama-administration-separate-families/
We tried to keep families together.
Trump implemented a new policy to separate parents from their children. We did that as a deterrence to keep other immigrants from trying to enter the US illegally.
Stop acting like Trumps hands were tied by a law. Separating families was his policy.
1. It was a stupid thing to wear. Clearly sends the wrong message, and was an intentional distraction.
2. Why are you ok with the First Lady trolling people?
1- you know what Melania is thinking?
2- why are you OK with the media inaccurately reporting what is going on?
https://www.huffingtonpost.com/ju-hong/president-obama-stop-sepa_b_4371244.html
I'm confused then by this 2013 article because Obama was deporting parents according to this. I guess separating families was okay then and since there was no law tying his hands Obama did this for fun???? I guess you only listen when Chuck, Nancy, CNN, and MSNBC talk about this issue. Because they didn't talk about it then, it didn't happen in your world.
I don’t care what she was thinking.
She either wasn’t, or it was intentional.
Neither of those options are good. It’s not a national incident. You brought it up. Just acknowledge that it was stupid and move along.
You’re comparing illegal immigrants who have been living in our country for years to those crossing the border requesting asylum.
You really think those are comparable?
It depends if you think separating a family is wrong. I guess you are saying there are times it is acceptable to separate families.
