Villanova / Cabrini Merger

[HALL85]

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/v...acquire-cabrini-university-campus/ar-AA1jhgly

Cabrini was in a free fall so this made sense. Blueprint for a SHU / St. Elizabeth merger?

 

[SOBO1]

I know many posters are tired of this topic so I apologize in advance ….

A recent Harvard study predicted that up to 50% of colleges will either close or merge in the coming years.

Villanova purchased Cabrini - this was not a merger. It made a lot of sense for Nova due to the proximity of the campuses (5 minutes/2miles). Also, Cabrini is in exponentially better shape than St. E’s.

It’s unfortunate St. E’s campus isn’t closer because that would be a nice opportunity to solve our land challenge. If the infrastructure of the campus was in better shape or we had the financial means to rehab the campus it might make more sense.

Also, Drew which is also experiencing financial hardship is about 2 minutes down the road (combined they are ~400 acres). FDU also shares a border with St.E’s. It wouldn’t shock me in in 15-20 years all three campus merged (total 600 acres all within walking distance).

 

[HALL85]

I know many posters are tired of this topic so I apologize in advance ….

A recent Harvard study predicted that up to 50% of colleges will either close or merge in the coming years.

Villanova purchased Cabrini - this was not a merger. It made a lot of sense for Nova due to the proximity of the campuses (5 minutes/2miles). Also, Cabrini is in exponentially better shape than St. E’s.

It’s unfortunate St. E’s campus isn’t closer because that would be a nice opportunity to solve our land challenge. If the infrastructure of the campus was in better shape or we had the financial means to rehab the campus it might make more sense.

Also, Drew which is also experiencing financial hardship is about 2 minutes down the road (combined they are ~400 acres). FDU also shares a border with St.E’s. It wouldn’t shock me in in 15-20 years all three campus merged (total 600 acres all within walking distance).

From a proximity standpoint I would agree, but the charters of those three schools are very different. In addition, the FDU Madison campus is one of three, so they could shut down one or two and consolidate if so inclined.

I use the term merger, as that’s what the article termed it. It’s essentially an asset transfer rather than an acquisition.

 

[TrueBlue1989]

I know many posters are tired of this topic so I apologize in advance ….

A recent Harvard study predicted that up to 50% of colleges will either close or merge in the coming years.

Villanova purchased Cabrini - this was not a merger. It made a lot of sense for Nova due to the proximity of the campuses (5 minutes/2miles). Also, Cabrini is in exponentially better shape than St. E’s.

It’s unfortunate St. E’s campus isn’t closer because that would be a nice opportunity to solve our land challenge. If the infrastructure of the campus was in better shape or we had the financial means to rehab the campus it might make more sense.

Also, Drew which is also experiencing financial hardship is about 2 minutes down the road (combined they are ~400 acres). FDU also shares a border with St.E’s. It wouldn’t shock me in in 15-20 years all three campus merged (total 600 acres all within walking distance).

How does putting 3 weak schools together solve any problems? Combine the schools and SHU down 2 campuses could help. I don’t see a happy ending for them but I hope that I’m wrong.

 

[SHUisNJsTeam]

Sadly any acquisitions of land/struggling schools by Seton Hall will be put on the back burner until we have a new President in place (the way Seton Hall moves we will probably be waiting until Fall 2025 for that person to actually be on the campus payroll). Hopefully we get someone with a strong business background who understands the importance and has experience with top level D1 athletics, the need to greatly improve fundraising/alumni giving and capital expansion and can deal with and find ways around the nonsense we currently allow South Orange to get away with. We need someone with a true vision, a leader, not a follower.

Anyone want to reach out the Villanova’s President and see if he’d like to move to north Jersey?

 

[HALL85]

Sadly any acquisitions of land/struggling schools by Seton Hall will be put on the back burner until we have a new President in place (the way Seton Hall moves we will probably be waiting until Fall 2025 for that person to actually be on the campus payroll). Hopefully we get someone with a strong business background who understands the importance and has experience with top level D1 athletics, the need to greatly improve fundraising/alumni giving and capital expansion and can deal with and find ways around the nonsense we currently allow South Orange to get away with. We need someone with a true vision, a leader, not a follower.

Anyone want to reach out the Villanova’s President and see if he’d like to move to north Jersey?

The board can move on that even without a sitting president. But I wouldn’t bank on that given the inaction on NIL. My guess is that Saint Elizabeth’s will be the driver and will only take action when the plane is about to hit the mountain.

 

[Seton75]

IMO, St E's makes no sense. We are landlocked in a town impossible to work with and moving to a new location is way too expensive. So I expect this to be discussed here 20 years from now like it was 20 years ago.

 

[SHUisNJsTeam]

IMO, St E's makes no sense. We are landlocked in a town impossible to work with and moving to a new location is way too expensive. So I expect this to be discussed here 20 years from now like it was 20 years ago.

We wouldn’t have to move the main campus, it would become a satellite campus. We could also build and expand things up there that the hateful folks in South Orange won’t allow.

 

[Seton75]

We wouldn’t have to move the main campus, it would become a satellite campus. We could also build and expand things up there that the hateful folks in South Orange won’t allow.

I know and don't think it enhances our school. We cannot do things in SO that they wont allow so I put that off the table and out of my mind.

I think we have improved the infrastructure about as much as is possible. And I think the expansion was done very well. Have not seen the student center yet. The library is great and I dont even know what I am walking past when on campus so much is new since the 70s.

And in this climate, I think caution is the word. Schools are closing. Money is tight. Maybe some genius admin will be in charge and have a vision I hadn't considered. But I have not heard a suggestion that seems a winner to me.

The last guy who dreamed big would have probably bankrupted us if it went forward

 

[SHUisNJsTeam]

I know and dont think it enhances our school. We cannot do things in SO that they wont allow so I put that off the table and out of my mind.

I think we have improved the infrastructure about as much as is possible. And I think the expansion was done very well. Have not seen the student center yet. The library is great and I dont even know what I am walking past when on capmus so much is new since the 70s.

And in this climate, I think caution is the word. Schools are closing. Money is tight. Maybe some genius admin will be in chanrge and have a vision I hadnt considered. But I have not heard a suggestion that seems a winner to me. The last guy who dreamed big would have probably bankrupted us if it went forward

So stay status quo while others pass us by? How well has that worked for NIL? I don’t want a campus wide reenactment of the current NIL disaster. St. Elizabeth will be looking to acquire us in that type of scenario.

You allude to Dr. Esteban and the medical school. Am I the only one who thinks he could not have done that all alone? Others on the Board of Trustees and Board of Regents had to sign on as well. Easy to blame Dr. Esteban because he’s no longer here whereas the others are still here. Why does no one hold them accountable for anything? These decisions aren’t made in a vacuum and more than one person has to give their blessing and sign off on the deal.

 

[The Crows Nest]

I know and dont think it enhances our school. We cannot do things in SO that they wont allow so I put that off the table and out of my mind.

I think we have improved the infrastructure about as much as is possible. And I think the expansion was done very well. Have not seen the student center yet. The library is great and I dont even know what I am walking past when on capmus so much is new since the 70s.

And in this climate, I think caution is the word. Schools are closing. Money is tight. Maybe some genius admin will be in chanrge and have a vision I hadnt considered. But I have not heard a suggestion that seems a winner to me. The last guy who dreamed big would have probably bankrupted us if it went forward

I do agree caution is the word...especially as it relates to the future of "higher learning".

It appears a bubble is bursting with regard to tuition and the willingness to pay at such heights; also, overall question of the true "value" of said education...other than "name value"...how much more valuable is an education at "prestigious institution X" vs "a lot less prestigious institution Y"...and what will people in the future pay for that difference...or will they.

Virtual learning? Focused, targeted learning (vs a more broad approach). I am not touting one over the other...I just think these issues...and more, will come to be discussed more and more given economic and social realities

 

[SHUisNJsTeam]

I do agree caution is the word...especially as it relates to the future of "higher learning".

It appears a bubble is bursting with regard to tuition and the willingness to pay at such heights; also, overall question of the true "value" of said education...other than "name value"...how much more valuable is an education at "prestigious institution X" vs "a lot less prestigious institution Y"...and what will people in the future pay for that difference...or will they.

Virtual learning? Focused, targeted learning (vs a more broad approach). I am not touting one over the other...I just think these issues...and more, will come to be discussed more and more given economic and social realities

Part of the problem is that in the recent past the focus and thinking has been on ‘everyone needs to go to college’ or you’re basically a failure doomed to be a greeter at Walmart.

This line of thinking has driven generations away from the trades which are still desperately needed. Not everyone needs to or wants to go to college and they can still be quite successful not doing so. Put the trades back into schools and get rid of all the nonsense they are currently pushing. Teach people how to fix things instead of filling up the landfills with items that can have a much longer lifespan than the thinking that things need to be replaced every 3 to 5 years that some would like you to believe.

Yes, there will still be virtual learning, which is fine, but it won’t replace in person learning. And yes, some smaller institutions will close, mainly because there are just too many without enough demand along with the realization that not everyone needs to or wants to go to college. Get back to a balance of where you actually need a college education along with the trades that are also needed.

 

[SOBO1]

I actually find this topic very interesting and could talk about it for hours. I am firmly in agreement with @HALL85 that the school needs to do something to expand the geographic footprint of the campus. In my opinion the vast majority of our challenges stem from lack of land (student housing, alumni giving rate, athletics, etc.).

It’s extremely difficult to remain competitive in today’s collegiate landscape on a 58 acre campus you are prohibited from building “up” on.

It’s never a bad idea to acquire land because the one thing I am certain of is they aren’t making any more of it. St. E’s might not be ideal but it may be the only option. Hypothetically, in 50 years Drew could close too then you have potentially 400 acres within a mile of one another.

 

[Seton75]

Do we need to expand in these times? I dont see that as a given.

With the right opportuniuty you have to consider it. I dont see this as the right opportunity. (I used to do biz with St E's and FDU Mad and Teaneck. Always thought Madison was a nice campus and St E's closer to a dump - this was about 15 years ago)

 

[HALL85]

I actually find this topic very interesting and could talk about it for hours. I am firmly in agreement with @HALL85 that the school needs to do something to expand the geographic footprint of the campus. In my opinion the vast majority of our challenges stem from lack of land (student housing, alumni giving rate, athletics, etc.).

It’s extremely difficult to remain competitive in today’s collegiate landscape on a 58 acre campus you are prohibited from building “up” on.

It’s never a bad idea to acquire land because the one thing I am certain of is they aren’t making any more of it. St. E’s might not be ideal but it may be the only option. Hypothetically, in 50 years Drew could close too then you have potentially 400 acres within a mile of one another.

The traditional college model is prime target for disruptive change. Small private schools are struggling. You either grow through acquisition/merger, grow through reinventing yourself or be acquired.

Trades are one area, but more kids are choosing alternative paths. Where does the AI expert learn their trade? More and more developers are not going the traditional college route?

I hope SHU is working on that long range plan, but I’m not betting on it.

Don’t expand for the sake of expansion. Cabrini looks like they needed an exit and between the endowment, proximity and perceived leverage Villanova gets made it worth it. If St. E’s has no endowment, a physical plant in need of millions of investment, is the climb worth the view?

 

[TrueBlue1989]

Do we need to expand in these times? I dont see that as a given.

With the right opportuniuty you have to consider it. I dont see this as the right opportunity. (I used to do biz with St E's and FDU Mad and Teaneck. Always thought Madison was a nice campus and St E's closer to a dump - this was about 15 years ago)

College age students population is shrinking, why would a school want more buildings? Plus any school acquired would have massive deferred capex.

 

[SHUisNJsTeam]

College age students population is shrinking, why would a school want more buildings? Plus any school acquired would have massive deferred capex.

If you are expanding or adding new programs or schools, trying to increase your resident population, adding new athletic programs or adding additional non-academic spaces for students then you would need more land and buildings for those capital improvements. All of those things can help tremendously with attracting and retaining students.

 

[thehall07]

You need to expand and retract your offerings to support the future, that is the growth we need.

 

[MichiganStoleTitle]

We wouldn’t have to move the main campus, it would become a satellite campus. We could also build and expand things up there that the hateful folks in South Orange won’t allow.

What would one do at this “satellite” campus? Wouldn’t students find it annoying—and possibly even a deal breaker—if they had to shuttle between the two (or missed out on main campus experience because they were only at satellite) * ?

I went to undergrad and grad school at universities that located certain of their departments (e.g., engineering, law, business) and/or dorms a mere mile or so away from main campus and even that was a detriment in my opinion. Ten miles away seems like another universe.

* Excepting standalone graduate schools that don’t really require interaction with rest of campus.