Bravo Lindsey Graham

[HallBall10]

I agree with you, that leadership matters. Probably why Congress is failing us today because there is such a grave lack of it. Roughly 130million people voted for two morally corrupt candidates in 2016. They didn’t have to, but they did. Demand better candidates and don’t fall into the blind ideology.

I don't believe it's a one party issue but,

at this moment republicans should be demanding that america is better than all of this. If Lindsey graham and others thought that the republican base wanted better than he'd go right back to "tell Donald Trump to go to Hell". Instead they refuse to acknowledge his behavior because their people are telling them that it would be worse for them politically to do the right thing than it would be to do the wrong thing and allow this behavior.

 

[HallBall10]

No unemployment check but plenty of government programs that support them. We will reclass the funds to welfare, food stamps etc. Don’t get me wrong, I believe those things are needed. That’s not even the real issue. The real issue is if people who don’t participate get the rewards(socialism) then what percentage of other people will stop working.

There will always be people that exploit the law. It could be billionaires skirting tax laws with honey bee farms (i think that was your NJ farm point) or Trump's tax plan or some people being lazy to take advantage of some welfare programs or disability benefits while other's require the help .

Dems say focus on the billionaires. Republicans say focus on the lazy people. Every single issue isn't as polarizing as most would like you to think.

 

[SHUHoopsFan]

There will always be people that exploit the law. It could be billionaires skirting tax laws with honey bee farms (i think that was your NJ farm point) or Trump's tax plan or some people being lazy to take advantage of some welfare programs or disability benefits while other's require the help.

Actually my point was more to the fact even the most hardcore liberals like Jon Bon Jovi and Bruce Springsteen don't want liberal policies applied to them so they skirt the same laws they preach about.

 

[HallBall10]

I agree with you, that leadership matters. Probably why Congress is failing us today because there is such a grave lack of it. Roughly 130million people voted for two morally corrupt candidates in 2016. They didn’t have to, but they did. Demand better candidates and don’t fall into the blind ideology.

So as you mentioned Trump is a morally corrupt candidate for the republicans in 2020. Why is there not a push for another candidate?

Would Kasich or some other candidate really have no shot at winning against a guy that you know is a horrible human being?

 

[SHUHoopsFan]

So as you mentioned Trump is a morally corrupt candidate for the republicans in 2020. Why is there not a push for another candidate?

Would Kasich or some other candidate really have no shot at winning against a guy that you know is a horrible human being?

Most likely because in leadership roles, you're looking for the best leaders. Heck I'm not so sure how moral Washington, Jefferson, Lincoln, etc were but if you could lead the people, most don't care about your personal life as long as you don't let it influence your work. It appears that there are enough republicans to that think he is a leading just fine. JFK had his own moral issues, but I'd vote for the man today if he was running.

 

[HallBall10]

Most likely because in leadership roles, you're looking for the best leaders. Heck I'm not so sure how moral Washington, Jefferson, Lincoln, etc were but if you could lead the people, most don't care about your personal life as long as you don't let it influence your work. It appears that there are enough republicans to that think he is a leading just fine. JFK had his own moral issues, but I'd vote for the man today if he was running.

To get that people to yell "lock her up" or " send her back" is something.

I personally don't want that type of leadership. And I don't think most republicans what that either but they have been fear mongered into silence and obedience.

 

[Merge]

Unemployment rate has nothing to do with people wanting to work. If you do not attempt to find a job, you’re not considered unemployed so those people don’t factor into the rate. A ton of people who don’t want to go to work and do the bare minimum at their jobs. In our society you need to work for our nation to prosper. The vast majority do want to work. However show them a system where people get the same reward for not working. See what happens.

Good thing literally no one is proposing such a system then.

 

[SHUHoopsFan]

To get that people to yell "lock her up" or " send her back" is something.

I personally don't want that type of leadership. And I don't think most republicans what that either but they have been fear mongered into silence and obedience.

You're making the case against Trump with the idea of the perfect candidate that doesn't exist. Who is going to run that is morally supreme, keeps the markets up and confident, fights to bring back jobs in the country, and all the good things he has done. To sit there and ignore the good things he's done is as silly those who focus only on the good things he's done. Lock her up is one thing because the woman bleached an entire server, illegally. To say send her back for her speech which is a 1st amendment right is insane.

 

[HallBall10]

You're making the case against Trump with the idea of the perfect candidate that doesn't exist. Who is going to run that is morally supreme, keeps the markets up and confident, fights to bring back jobs in the country, and all the good things he has done. To sit there and ignore the good things he's done is as silly those who focus only on the good things he's done. Lock her up is one thing because the woman bleached an entire server, illegally. To say send her back for her speech which is a 1st amendment right is insane.

I think their is some middle ground between perfect and trump. Don't you?

We all have our levels of acceptance away from the perfect spectrum. Mine has been far exceeded. Maybe you draw yours at bleached servers or maybe it's rape of a 13 year old caught on video or murder on 5th avenue. I don't know where you draw your line but for me it's been exceeded. I think for most republicans it's been exceeded and they try to look away as much as possible or focus on the far-left.

Trump has continued Obama's good market and unemployment numbers. Kudos. Most think he's also caused harm with his tariffs (any end in sight?) and has added to our debt (like Obama).

 

[HALL85]

I don't believe it's a one party issue but,

at this moment republicans should be demanding that america is better than all of this. If Lindsey graham and others thought that the republican base wanted better than he'd go right back to "tell Donald Trump to go to Hell". Instead they refuse to acknowledge his behavior because their people are telling them that it would be worse for them politically to do the right thing than it would be to do the wrong thing and allow this behavior.

You should have stopped after "but"....

 

[Merge]

You should have stopped after "but"....

No he shouldn't have. It's a valid point.
If watching that crowd chant send her home doesn't give you pause, then your blinded by partisanship.

Thankfully Justin Amash at least has the balls to call it out. The rest are afraid of Trump's rabid base.

 

[HALL85]

No he shouldn't have. It's a valid point.
If watching that crowd chant send her home doesn't give you pause, then your blinded by partisanship.

Thankfully Justin Amash at least has the balls to call it out. The rest are afraid of Trump's rabid base.

It’s a valid point if you’re a partisan hack.

 

[HallBall10]

It’s a valid point if you’re a partisan hack.

"Political hack" is a pejorative term describing a person who is part of the political party apparatus, but whose intentions are more aligned with victory than personal conviction.

Lmao. This exactly what this thread is about. Graham and others are political hacks. To be fair it happens on both sides no doubt about it. Paul Ryan retired because he knew his only options were to be a political hack, stand up for his personal convictions (and be killed by his party for not liking trump bragging about grabbing married women by the pussy.) or retire. Personal conviction has been silenced. If the feedback was that republicans like trump's economic policies but want an end to the racist bullshit then graham and others would stand up to trump. But the feedback just isn't there, it's been silenced.

To get re-elected Graham must ignore the bigotry and racism that he's called trump out on in the past and must ignore his own convictions that he's stated in the past so that he doesn't anger his either bigot or silent and obedient voting base. Good dog, sit.

 

[knowknow456]

The President standing at the podium and saying nothing while his supporters chanted "Send her back" is not what I want for my country.

 

[SHUHoopsFan]

The President standing at the podium and saying nothing while his supporters chanted "Send her back" is not what I want for my country.

You can pick something from every president and say that is not what I want for my country. Do you want a president that says "Argue with the neighnors, get in their face". Or a president who tells Russia he'll have more flexibility after the election. Jesus Christ is not coming down to be President of the USA. So no president will be close to perfect, but you can find MANY that is not what I want for my country moments with every president and every candidate.

 

[HALL85]

"Political hack" is a pejorative term describing a person who is part of the political party apparatus, but whose intentions are more aligned with victory than personal conviction.

Lmao. This exactly what this thread is about. Graham and others are political hacks. To be fair it happens on both sides no doubt about it. Paul Ryan retired because he knew his only options were to be a political hack, stand up for his personal convictions (and be killed by his party for not liking trump bragging about grabbing married women by the pussy.) or retire. Personal conviction has been silenced. If the feedback was that republicans like trump's economic policies but want an end to the racist bullshit then graham and others would stand up to trump. But the feedback just isn't there, it's been silenced.

To get re-elected Graham must ignore the bigotry and racism that he's called trump out on in the past and must ignore his own convictions that he's stated in the past so that he doesn't anger his either bigot or silent and obedient voting base. Good dog, sit.

Just stop. Both sides are guilty. Trump’s remarks are indefensible....Gail King asked Omar more than once if she was anti-Semitic and she wouldn’t answer directly. Just as indefensible. You forget Tahlib called Trump a m-fer?

 

[knowknow456]

You can pick something from every president and say that is not what I want for my country. Do you want a president that says "Argue with the neighnors, get in their face". Or a president who tells Russia he'll have more flexibility after the election. Jesus Christ is not coming down to be President of the USA. So no president will be close to perfect, but you can find MANY that is not what I want for my country moments with every president and every candidate.

The President standing at the podium and saying nothing while his supporters chanted "Send her back" is not what I want for my country.

You can agree or you can rationalize. You've chosen rationalization which is your prerogative.

 

[HallBall10]

You can pick something from every president and say that is not what I want for my country. Do you want a president that says "Argue with the neighnors, get in their face". Or a president who tells Russia he'll have more flexibility after the election. Jesus Christ is not coming down to be President of the USA. So no president will be close to perfect, but you can find MANY that is not what I want for my country moments with every president and every candidate.

your whole justification is that well no one is perfect so he gets a pass on everything?

he was accused by a 13 year old child of being a pedofile at a convicted pedofiles (trump's friend) house in which trump's appointee helped the pedofile get a slap on the wrist. Yes it is just an accusation but teamed up with him getting caught on camera bragging about being a sexual predator and his wife's rape allegation. I'm pretty sure both parties have several candidates that aren't horrible humans.

 

[SHUHoopsFan]

your whole justification is that well no one is perfect so he gets a pass on everything?

he was accused by a 13 year old child of being a pedofile at a convicted pedofiles (trump's friend) house in which trump's appointee helped the pedofile get a slap on the wrist. Yes it is just an accusation but teamed up with him getting caught on camera bragging about being a sexual predator and his wife's rape allegation. I'm pretty sure both parties have several candidates that aren't horrible humans.

No justification, just find someone to beat him. I'm not giving him a pass, but if there's a moral human being out there that's going to beat him, go for it. You're not going to find one.

There are quite a few morally challenged on stage on the democratic debates. Booker has his history. Kamala has used sex from the other end of the spectrum to advance her career, sleeping with married men. Creepy Joe is making ladies feel uncomfortable. Where's the outrage on any of this? Trump should face all the penalties any regular citizien should face if true. Condemn both sides.

 

[knowknow456]

Is there one Republican willing to challenge the current President?

 

[SHUHoopsFan]

Is there one Republican willing to challenge the current President?

Most likely not. Who wants to spend their time and resources with minimal chance to beat him.

 

[knowknow456]

Most likely not. Who wants to spend their time and resources with minimal chance to beat him.

I think maybe Republicans should stop worrying about the Democrats and focus on how to find and develop a candidate that will better represent the Party and the country.

 

[NYShoreGuy]

If you don’t qualify as unemployed (not seeking work) then you don’t get an unemployment check correct? And if so you aren’t getting same reward.

In NJ on a weekly benefit claim you have to answer 10 questions. Do you really think most people are happy to be on unemployment? the NJ max is 626 a week with fed taxes taken out

 

[SHUHoopsFan]

I think maybe Republicans should stop worrying about the Democrats and focus on how to find and develop a candidate that will better represent the Party and the country.

I think that goes beyond Republicans. Same goes for democrats. White people should stop worrying about non white people. Non white people should stop worrying about white people. Straight people should stop worrying about gay people. Gay people should stop worrying about straight people. If everyone focused on making themselves better, we'd all be better off. We don't need Trump, Pelosi, McConnell, or Schumer to tell us how to be better. There's a pretty good book called The Bible. It's good for that.

 

[knowknow456]

If everyone focused on making themselves better, we'd all be better off.

I agree. Republicans should focus on finding and developing a candidate that will better represent the Party and the country.

 

[SHUHoopsFan]

I agree. Republicans should focus on finding and developing a candidate that will better represent the Party and the country.

Democrats share that same responsibility.

 

[knowknow456]

Democrats share that same responsibility.

I don't think Republicans should worry about the Democrats. Let the Democrats take care of themselves. If everyone focused on making themselves better, we'd all be better off.

Republicans should should focus on finding and developing a candidate that will better represent the Party and the country. If they do that it, everything else will fall into place.

 

[SHUHoopsFan]

I don't think Republicans should worry about the Democrats. Let the Democrats take care of themselves. If everyone focused on making themselves better, we'd all be better off.

Republicans should should focus on finding and developing a candidate that will better represent the Party and the country. If they do that it, everything else will fall into place.

I agree let the Democrats focus on themselves. That would mean 0 mention of Trump during their debates. Let’s see how long that lasts.

 

[knowknow456]

I agree let the Democrats focus on themselves. That would mean 0 mention of Trump during their debates. Let’s see how long that lasts.

I don't worry about how much or how little the Democrats reference the President. I am fully focused on the Republican party. The Republicans should be focused on making themselves better.

 

[SHUHoopsFan]

I don't worry about how much or how little the Democrats reference the President. I am fully focused on the Republican party. The Republicans should be focused on making themselves better.

Make Trump even better.

 

[Pirata]

I had lunch yesterday with a Democrat friend and elected official in a local county here in eastern PA. He recently spoke with Susan Wild, freshman congresswoman, Democrat.

He had asked her jokingly if she was going to join the squad. He said she responded to the effect that they are toxic and no one is going near them. He added his own comments to me that they are off the wall.

If I were a Democrat, I'd be pissed at the MSM. They are giving the squad way too much attention and hurting their party.

As a Republican, I love it. While chasing ratings, the MSM will end up helping Trump get elected again.

 

[afghan whigs]

 

[Merge]

I had lunch yesterday with a Democrat friend and elected official in a local county here in eastern PA. He recently spoke with Susan Wild, freshman congresswoman, Democrat.

He had asked her jokingly if she was going to join the squad. He said she responded to the effect that they are toxic and no one is going near them. He added his own comments to me that they are off the wall.

If I were a Democrat, I'd be pissed at the MSM. They are giving the squad way too much attention and hurting their party.

As a Republican, I love it. While chasing ratings, the MSM will end up helping Trump get elected again.

If they weren't around, would we be talking about how unified the party is and how that will lead to a decisive 2020 win? I really doubt that... More likely the villain for the right would still be pelosi.

I personally view them more as a chaotic good right now. Eventually I hope they find a more unifying message, and I think they will.

Again, there is so much time between now and next November. I don't think there is anything these women will do in the next several months that will impact 2020, but again I do think they will need to fully support the eventual nominee and party platform.

 

[SHUHoopsFan]

If they weren't around, would we be talking about how unified the party is and how that will lead to a decisive 2020 win? I really doubt that... More likely the villain for the right would still be pelosi.

I personally view them more as a chaotic good right now. Eventually I hope they find a more unifying message, and I think they will.

Again, there is so much time between now and next November. I don't think there is anything these women will do in the next several months that will impact 2020, but again I do think they will need to fully support the eventual nominee and party platform.

They’ve shown no ability to compromise as of yet. Time will tell.

 

[Merge]

They’ve shown no ability to compromise as of yet. Time will tell.

I don't disagree, but they have been office for 6 months. They were making some noise early on and the right started going after them. Their response in the spotlight hasn't been strong or effective.

Plenty of time for a course correction.

 

[SHUHoopsFan]

I don't disagree, but they have been office for 6 months. They were making some noise early on and the right started going after them. Their response in the spotlight hasn't been strong or effective.

Plenty of time for a course correction.

Compromise is a life skill. 10 year olds are better at it. We will see

 

[knowknow456]

Make Trump even better.

The President has shown himself to be stubbornly resistant to keeping any counsel other than his own. As a Republican strategy, "Making Trump even better" has a high probability of failure.

This also implies there is no one in the Republican Party that can better represent the Party and the Country.

 

[SHUHoopsFan]

The President has shown himself to be stubbornly resistant to keeping any counsel other than his own. As a Republican strategy, "Making Trump even better" has a high probability of failure.

This also implies there is no one in the Republican Party that can better represent the Party and the Country.

1. The high probability of failure is your opinion. Many believe things will get better than things currently are.

2. It doesn't imply that at all that there is no one better. There are many possibilities. Think outside the box. Maybe nobody wants to run against him. Maybe some people like their role and don't want to be President. But just because he's going to be the parties nomination doesn't mean he is the best in the party. He will win re-election because quite frankly, he might go against the 2 worst candidates in democratic party history.

 

[knowknow456]

1. The high probability of failure is your opinion. Many believe things will get better than things currently are.

2. It doesn't imply that at all that there is no one better. There are many possibilities. Think outside the box. Maybe nobody wants to run against him. Maybe some people like their role and don't want to be President. But just because he's going to be the parties nomination doesn't mean he is the best in the party. He will win re-election because quite frankly, he might go against the 2 worst candidates in democratic party history.

Winning re-election because the other team is worse is definitely a strategy. My only comment was that the Republican Party should be developing better candidates. Your reply is they can't and they won't. That's a shame.

 

[SHUHoopsFan]

Winning re-election because the other team is worse is definitely a strategy. My only comment was that the Republican Party should be developing better candidates. Your reply is they can't and they won't. That's a shame.

Stop putting words in my mouth. I never said that nor did I imply that. #FakeNews.

What I will say is if these candidates suck so much, you should run. That's the beauty of this country, you have the ability to do that.