Trump

[shu09]

It was interesting timing that I watched Churchill's secret on PBS last night. Clearly seems to be a bigger health issue then they are leading on...i was kind of hoping that she wouldn't make it to the election. Sounds like she will though.

I have no idea what her health situation is and I'd never wish anybody ill will but if she isn't healthy enough, she shouldn't continue. The bigger issue is her continued lack of transparency and the perception that she is untrustworthy. This incident only reinforces that belief. David Axelrod had a great tweet about that today.

Contemplating the chaos that a Hillary withdrawal would throw this election into though, is unbelievable. However, this cycle has had it all. Nothing would surprise me. Truth be told, I'd be totally fine with Joe Biden or Tim Kaine as the next president. Unfortunately, that won't happen without Hillary leaving the race. That's something I just can't hope for in good conscience.

 

[Merge]

To clarify, I didn't mean that she would die.. Just that she would have to drop out.

 

[shu09]

To clarify, I didn't mean that she would die.. Just that she would have to drop out.

I know, but I can think of no reason she would drop out other than a debilitating health issue.

 

[49ers10]

Obviously, I am not a Hillary fan however, I do not wish her any ill health.

I cannot believe her statements today when she dissed millions of Americans when she stated "You know, to just be grossly generalistic, you could put half of Trump’s supporters into what I call the basket of deplorables. Right? The racist, sexist, homophobic, xenophobic, Islamophobic — you name it."

I feel this will cause her to lose the undecided voters, in addition to strengthening Trump's support among some in his party, etc.

Hillary is in in serious trouble.

 

[Merge]

Agree on that. Her comments were horrible, not quite sure what the impact will be. I don't really see it as the same level of the 47% comment from Romney but it will hurt her. I hope whoever gave her the ok to say that is fired.

 

[HALL85]

I have no idea what her health issues are and some of these conspiracy theories are insane. The most troubling thing about yesterday was considering what they claim she is suffering from, how do you NOT take her directly to a hospital emergency room. A 68 year old woman, diagnosed with a pnemonia two days earlier and having a major health episode and she goes to her daughters apartment? Why? Because if she goes to the hospital, by law everything gets recorded (diagnosis, treatment, medications, etc.). And you can't control which healthcare workers see and know. It really looks as she is hiding whatever it is.

And if it was pnemonia, what kind of judgement does that show, going out in public with a contagious disease and exposing it to hundreds/thousands of people at the Friday fundraiser, 9/11 ceremony and the child that she confronted in front of the apartment.

 

[Section112]

Here is a theory - out there but you never know. Is this the way Hillary will bow out? Do the Dems think there is a chance she might lose and are getting ready to insert Joe Biden? Crazier things have happened and when you think you've seen it all in this election another shoe drops. Just a crazy theory I admit ...

 

[Merge]

Here is a theory - out there but you never know. Is this the way Hillary will bow out? Do the Dems think there is a chance she might lose and are getting ready to insert Joe Biden? Crazier things have happened and when you think you've seen it all in this election another shoe drops. Just a crazy theory I admit ...

I really don't think so. There have been rumors about her poor health for months, and she still holds a solid lead in the path to 270. If anything, I'd buy that they are covering up a serious condition saying it is pneumonia though.

 

[cernjSHU]

Obviously, I am not a Hillary fan however, I do not wish her any ill health.

I cannot believe her statements today when she dissed millions of Americans when she stated "You know, to just be grossly generalistic, you could put half of Trump’s supporters into what I call the basket of deplorables. Right? The racist, sexist, homophobic, xenophobic, Islamophobic — you name it."

I feel this will cause her to lose the undecided voters, in addition to strengthening Trump's support among some in his party, etc.

Hillary is in in serious trouble.

Not concerned about her health. That is why you have Vice Presidents. I have had the walking pneumonia. She should rest for a week. Although you may feel great in the morning, by the afternoon, you will feel that all energy is completely sapped from you. She needs to be careful here. Btw, FDR and JFK both had health problems in which the public had no idea.

With regard to her deplorable comment, it was certainly not a good statement to make. I understand what she was saying and there is an undercurrent in Trump supporters that certainly can be described as that. But, you just don't say that. Dumb comment.

However, Trump makes horrendous comments on almost a daily basis. Say outrageous things often and loudly and people become numb to it is apparently Trump's belief.

 

[HALL85]

Trump says stupid stuff every day, but essentially what Clinton did was an insult to Americans. For someone who had the easiest path of all time to the presidency, she is doing a bang up job of trying to give it all away on her own.

 

[Section112]

I really don't think so. There have been rumors about her poor health for months, and she still holds a solid lead in the path to 270. If anything, I'd buy that they are covering up a serious condition saying it is pneumonia though.

You are probably right Merge. Here is a video that is out there. Never know if these are doctored or not (very possible) but it appears she lost it for a few seconds and her aide reacted and immediately went to get her on track and hold her up.

Have a friend who is a doctor who thinks it's possible she may have Parkinsons. If true this might explain why she has been avoiding press conferences for so long. Parkinsons does not jive with the coughing fit though - that is more classic pneumonia. I've had pneumonia before and I did not bounce back in 2 hours to make an appearance. It can really beat you down. The whole thing is very strange.

Regardless her health is now a huge issue in this campaign.

 

[Merge]

Trump says stupid stuff every day, but essentially what Clinton did was an insult to Americans. For someone who had the easiest path of all time to the presidency, she is doing a bang up job of trying to give it all away on her own.

In context it wasn't an insult to Americans at all. Not even close if you listen to the full clip.
Politically it was a horrible thing to say, just really dumb when all you need is an out of context clip to kill you.

Romney's 47% comments were a little more damaging since Hillary was talking about a group of Trumps supporters. She is not gonna win them over anyway. The question is will independents be turned off by Hillary saying Trump's has a bucket of racist voters?

 

[HALL85]

In context it wasn't an insult to Americans at all. Not even close if you listen to the full clip.
Politically it was a horrible thing to say, just really dumb when all you need is an out of context clip to kill you.

Romney's 47% comments were a little more damaging since Hillary was talking about a group of Trumps supporters. She is not gonna win them over anyway. The question is will independents be turned off by Hillary saying Trump's has a bucket of racist voters?

She was insulting a large group of Americans no matter what context you put it in. Doesn't matter though, since she just handed Trump a "What's Aleppo" sound byte which they have already made an ad about. Will it stick? Who knows, but she's doing her best to give the election to him.

 

[Seton75]

Racists are deplorable. Her mistake was associating it with his supporters and not to trumpo, who pretended he didn't know who David Duke is. Let's face it, lots of what many abhor is part of El trumpo' schtick. And if a dem sued so many people and stiffed so many contractors, a dem waffled like he has on virtually everything except who pays for the wall lolololol FOX news would create another channel to talk about. And while we talk about needing medical assistance, can someone please get Rudy to see a shrink as he is clearly out of his ****ing mind.

 

[HALL85]

Racists are deplorable. Her mistake was associating it with his supporters and not to trumpo, who pretended he didn't know who David Duke is. Let's face it, lots of what many abhor is part of El trumpo' schtick. And if a dem sued so many people and stiffed so many contractors, a dem waffled like he has on virtually everything except who pays for the wall lolololol FOX news would create another channel to talk about. And while we talk about needing medical assistance, can someone please get Rudy to see a shrink as he is clearly out of his ****ing mind.

I think "el Trumpo" would make a great name for the WALL...lol

 

[Merge]

Racists are deplorable.

I'm starting to wonder if her comment and backlash was intentional. I've notice a change in the narrative today basically asking if racists are deplorable (even asked of Pence) or not. It hasn't been about Hillary saying something dumb, it has been more about taking a look at who trumps supporters are.

The polling does suggest that some of trumps supporters have racist views... So the press will try to trap him into distancing himself from his "deplorable" (racist) supporters. If he doesn't it could hurt him more with moderates than Hillary.

 

[HALL85]

I'm starting to wonder if her comment and backlash was intentional. I've notice a change in the narrative today basically asking if racists are deplorable (even asked of Pence) or not. It hasn't been about Hillary saying something dumb, it has been more about taking a look at who trumps supporters are.

The polling does suggest that some of trumps supporters have racist views... So the press will try to trap him into distancing himself from his "deplorable" (racist) supporters. If he doesn't it could hurt him more with moderates than Hillary.

And their are no racist Dems? Don't think either party has the corner on that market.

 

[49ers10]

Clinton's aides pleading the 5th; emails; Hillary's "deplorable" comments; she is hiding again; should have said it was pneumonia (if it is) last Friday-not "overheated"-the silence/misinformation is resulting in more questions; Bill saying it "happened numerous, I mean...I mean a few times in the past"; this is not where you want to be at 50 days before the election.

The debates are going to be HUGE!


Drip, drip, drip...

 

[Merge]

And their are no racist Dems? Don't think either party has the corner on that market.

Of course there are... but "reality" doesn't matter in an election. Perception matters.
Has the economy improved in the last 8 years? Of course it has... Poll America and a huge number will say it hasn't.

The perception about Trump is that he promotes racist views and has racist supporters.
That perception does not really exist for Hillary.

I guess I am really asking the question if Hillary's camp will be able to spin this narrative from "Hillary insults Americans" to... "Are Trump's racist supporters deplorable". She apparently has been using the phrase for weeks, so I think it may not have been a gaffe but an intentional phrase to push a narrative.

 

[knowknow456]

I think it was a gaffe but the Clinton campaign has done a masterful job or redirecting the conversation.

In general, I do not believe the average voter cares that Trump has racist voters in his camp. In addition, I believe people don't really care if Trump himself is racist as long as his overall world view doesn't impact them directly

 

[donnie_baseball]

Not concerned about her health. That is why you have Vice Presidents. I have had the walking pneumonia. She should rest for a week. Although you may feel great in the morning, by the afternoon, you will feel that all energy is completely sapped from you. She needs to be careful here. Btw, FDR and JFK both had health problems in which the public had no idea.

You're not 68 years old. From the video, it didn't seem like she was doing much walking when it was time to leave.

 

[donnie_baseball]

I cannot believe her statements today when she dissed millions of Americans when she stated "You know, to just be grossly generalistic, you could put half of Trump’s supporters into what I call the basket of deplorables. Right? The racist, sexist, homophobic, xenophobic, Islamophobic — you name it."


Hillary is in in serious trouble.

There is one poster here who will be extremely disappointed that she forgot to put the misogynists in the basket. How about the Trump supporters (not me) who would rather chew off their own arm than vote for that decrepit old lizard?

She's in serious trouble? You and I, the voters, are in serious trouble.

 

[HALL85]

Has the economy improved in the last 8 years? Of course it has... Poll America and a huge number will say it hasn't.

Has it really? Before you start posting your set of metrics, I know you know that either side can make a case that it's better or worse, so save yourself. I ask myself, if everything was so rosy, how did we wind up with these two candidates?

 

[Merge]

Has it really? Before you start posting your set of metrics, I know you know that either side can make a case that it's better or worse, so save yourself. I ask myself, if everything was so rosy, how did we wind up with these two candidates?

Wasn't trying to get into a debate about the economy... My point was that how people feel doesn't necessarily reflect reality.

but come on... Of course the economy has improved. Hemorrhaging hundreds of thousands of jobs per month vs slow and fairly steady growth? You can make the argument that we are not as far along as we should be, but an argument that it has not would be one that ignore data.

 

[Section112]

The jobs numbers are very hard to dicipher with such a high % of underemployed right now. So many not collecting and the govt playing with the numbers. I think there has been a slow recovery but still many, many underemployed or folks that have left the workforce all together relying on the Govt dole (damn 47% ers - lol). Have a sister in that category - 54 great resume and experience and almost 2 yrs out of the workforce doing consulting but can't get a FT job. Also have a few nieces and nephews struggling to find jobs out of college as well. Not easy out there.

 

[Merge]

The jobs numbers are very hard to dicipher with such a high % of underemployed right now. So many not collecting and the govt playing with the numbers. I think there has been a slow recovery but still many, many underemployed or folks that have left the workforce all together relying on the Govt dole (damn 47% ers - lol). Have a sister in that category - 54 great resume and experience and almost 2 yrs out of the workforce doing consulting but can't get a FT job. Also have a few nieces and nephews struggling to find jobs out of college as well. Not easy out there.

Yeah, again, I wasn't trying to suggest that going through the recovery has been smooth sailing and we have arrived back on top... but if anyone would prefer to live in the economy of September 2008 instead of the economy of September 2016... then you may be slightly crazy.

 

[HALL85]

Yeah, again, I wasn't trying to suggest that going through the recovery has been smooth sailing and we have arrived back on top... but if anyone would prefer to live in the economy of September 2008 instead of the economy of September 2016... then you may be slightly crazy.

And that was my point. I guess "improved" covers a pretty wide swath and can be interpreted many different ways. "Sluggish recovery" is a better description.

 

[Merge]

And that was my point. I guess "improved" covers a pretty wide swath and can be interpreted many different ways. "Sluggish recovery" is a better description.

I used the word intentionally figuring it would be something everyone can agree on in a broad economic sense, and would be hard to disagree with. You are certainly trying though.

 

[Section112]

Yeah, again, I wasn't trying to suggest that going through the recovery has been smooth sailing and we have arrived back on top... but if anyone would prefer to live in the economy of September 2008 instead of the economy of September 2016... then you may be slightly crazy.

Agree on the economy of now vs. 2008 but I would take my health care plan from 2008 and the associated costs right now in a second. But that is not how it works unfortunately...

 

[Merge]

Agree on the economy of now vs. 2008 but I would take my health care plan from 2008 and the associated costs right now in a second. But that is not how it works unfortunately...

Indeed. I will also trade my back for my 2008 version... but the economy in general has improved.

 

[49ers10]

There is one poster here who will be extremely disappointed that she forgot to put the misogynists in the basket. How about the Trump supporters (not me) who would rather chew off their own arm than vote for that decrepit old lizard?

She's in serious trouble? You and I, the voters, are in serious trouble.

Yes, serious trouble

Drip, drip, drip...

 

[Seton75]

Trumps words are how he is painted. Many dont care if he shoots someone on 5th Ave as El trumpo the plump (most healthy obese candidate for pres in history...lol) has said. If you vote for Trump you are out of your mind. He is a small, manipulating rich kid who talks out of both sides of his mouth. He screws small contractors and sues at a rate that gives the ABA an erection. The great biz man has taken so many companies to backruptcy and reading about some like trump airlines has to make one doubt his biz wisdom. But people don't like hillary so you don't listen. How would you like and respect me if I held a fundraiser that raised lots of money via donations from you guys and then pirate blue feted ME when I turned it over to them as my own donation. Trump U. Wake the F up. Vote libertarian or green. Write in hall dan or spk. This country does not deserve pt barnum with more greed and cynicism as our leader. If Nixon was running, I would vote for him.

 

[HALL85]

Trumps words are how he is painted. Many dont care if he shoots someone on 5th Ave as El trumpo the plump (most healthy obese candidate for pres in history...lol) has said. If you vote for Trump you are out of your mind. He is a small, manipulating rich kid who talks out of both sides of his mouth. He screws small contractors and sues at a rate that gives the ABA an erection. The great biz man has taken so many companies to backruptcy and reading about some like trip airlines has to make one doubt his biz wisdom. But people don't like hillary so you don't listen. How would you like and respect me if I held a fundraiser that raised lots of money via donations from you guys and then pirate blue feted ME when I turned it over to them as my own donation. Trump U. Wake the F up. Vote libertarian or green. Write in hall dan or spk. This country does not deserve pt barnum with more greed and cynicism as our leader. If Nixon was running, I would vote for him.

You had me until you suggested writing in SPK....

I might write in Fjnj...he has passion, will make us a Top 3 country in the world and he's great at name-calling, citing you out as an RU fan.

 

[donnie_baseball]

Read this piece today:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opin...141a7beb626_story.html?utm_term=.aab29fcde0c6


I thought it was unintentionally thought-provoking. I can't figure whether people who would vote for Trump really buy any of his bullshit, or if they are simply casting a vote against governance that has treated them (the blue collar, the religious, the Midwesterners/Southerners) with the same condescension as this author. People on the left laughed when Obama made his "Bibles and guns" remarks, and when Pelosi made similarly insulting remarks, recently, about those who would vote Republican. The DNC tried to make a national hero out of Cecile Richards, for crying out loud.

As this race frighteningly tightens up, I don't hear anyone laughing. More importantly, I don't hear anyone on the left taking any blame for the Trump phenomenon. Keillor is doubling down on painting the Trump voters as rubes, drinking "cheap beer" and patronizingly pitting the "nice, church-going" country folk against the savvy New Yorkers. Hell, most of us live in a reliably blue state, and I certainly don't live out in the sticks, and I've seen more Trump lawn signs than I ever thought I would, and less "I'm with Hers" than I expected.

The obstructionist Republicans of the last 8 years, preceded by the war hawks of the 8 years before that, haven't helped our country in any way. But when will the other side take some culpability for creating this Trump-monster? We need a return to civil discourse, term limits, and legislators who put the good of the many before their own personal gain. Trump's success, and hopefully he doesn't win the election, needs to be a wake-up call, to both parties.

 

[shu09]

A big part of the appeal of Trump is the sense of, "we tried everything else, why not someone new?" He is anti-establishment in nearly every single thing he does, which is quite appealing to a large part of the population.

I too have seen many more Trump signs than Clinton. In fact, I can't recall seeing a single Clinton yard sign. I have seen some Clinton bumper stickers.

 

[Section112]

Don't forget that poll in the summer that said 79% of all Americans think the nation is going in the wrong direction. The prevailing thought is that if Hillary is elected that will continue and be more of the same. Trump is a nut but people are hoping he will be different. Lots more educated folks are voting for Trump than the liberal press gives credit for. And Hillary and the Clintons continue to do whatever they want and voters now see through it and the press that continues to do everything they can to put Hill in a good light and Trump in a bad light (although both candidates are doing a good job of putting them in a bad light too). Listen to Martha Radditz and you will hear her sticking up for Hillary in segments on ABC. Yet she is the first moderator of the first debate and you wonder why people are tired of the press and the same old direction of the US. There is something to the anyone but the current politicians in play and IMO that thought would have prevailed if Jeb Bush won the nomination on the Repub side too. Folks are simply tired of government not representing them.

A good friend of mine had the same feeling 8 years ago and typically voted Republican. He voted for Obama which was out of pattern for him for the same reasons as above. He now regrets it but his exact words where I thought I would try something new because its not working now and I respect his vote. Voters are pissed and unhappy - I just wish they would take the same vitriol on the elected representatives for the Congress and the Senate and stop keep putting the same old career politicians in place. They seem to focus too much on the Presidential election and the status quo continues.

 

[Muggsy Blue]

Josh Gottheimer

 

[cernjSHU]

A big part of the appeal of Trump is the sense of, "we tried everything else, why not someone new?" He is anti-establishment in nearly every single thing he does, which is quite appealing to a large part of the population.

I too have seen many more Trump signs than Clinton. In fact, I can't recall seeing a single Clinton yard sign. I have seen some Clinton bumper stickers.

Hillary doesn't inspire people. She doesn't electrify people. Moreover, for whatever reason, people have had a gut negative reaction to her. She does not have Bill Clinton's likability, his ability to break down complicated issues in simple words and phrases. She is not the ideal candidate for sure.

Meanwhile, Trump is charismatic. His ideas are simplistic that people get oh yeah, that's so true. Just build a wall and problem is solved. But people don't think. They like simple. Trump delivers simplicity even though the ideas are idiotic and the issues are complicated. Trump is a natural result of the Kardashianization of the country. People want a reality star as a President. My head spins.

Last night some wing nut started telling that the United Nations will now control the internet as of October 1.

 

[HALL85]

Hillary doesn't inspire people. She doesn't electrify people. Moreover, for whatever reason, people have had a gut negative reaction to her. She does not have Bill Clinton's likability, his ability to break down complicated issues in simple words and phrases. She is not the ideal candidate for sure.

Meanwhile, Trump is charismatic. His ideas are simplistic that people get oh yeah, that's so true. Just build a wall and problem is solved. But people don't think. They like simple. Trump delivers simplicity even though the ideas are idiotic and the issues are complicated. Trump is a natural result of the Kardashianization of the country. People want a reality star as a President. My head spins.

Last night some wing nut started telling that the United Nations will now control the internet as of October 1.

The problem with Clinton goes far beyond charisma and likability. She flat out lies and puts herself above the law. It's mostly about dishonesty and lack of trust with her driving the anti-Hillary vote.

No doubt that Trump has dumbed this election down to his benefit. But when has most of the electorate really done a lot of critical thinking about complex issues? "Hope and Change" bahaha...

I don't think it's as much as having a reality star as having an outsider given how disgusted a large share of the population is with our political system. We would never be here with Trump if people just did their jobs in Washington.

 

[cernjSHU]

The problem with Clinton goes far beyond charisma and likability. She flat out lies and puts herself above the law. It's mostly about dishonesty and lack of trust with her driving the anti-Hillary vote.

No doubt that Trump has dumbed this election down to his benefit. But when has most of the electorate really done a lot of critical thinking about complex issues? "Hope and Change" bahaha...

I don't think it's as much as having a reality star as having an outsider given how disgusted a large share of the population is with our political system. We would never be here with Trump if people just did their jobs in Washington.

It can't be about lying because when Trump's lips moves, he is lying. So if people don't like Hillary because she lies, then why isn't that same standard not put to Trump? People accuse the Clinton Foundation of being a piggy bank for the Clintons without one shred of proof. A foundation that does amazing work throughout the world. He ha clearly used his foundation, something he has not put a dine into since 2009 to buy paintings of himself and settle legal battles. Also, Trump somehow gets away without revealing his tax returns. How as a nation we are not demanding that he turns over his tax returns like any other candidate has done in both parties? What is hiding? This hypocrisy of Donald Trump is staggering.

And I don't get putting herself above the law? The emails? I stated on this board a year ago that no crime was committed that this was something that you can criticize her judgment but it's not a crime. Meanwhile, Donald Trump could screw over hard working contractors and other professionals throughout his career by breaking his contract and not paying them. Then extorting those people by threats of expensive litigation that could take several years to accept 20 or 30% of the contract price. How isn't this one of the most offensive things a person can do? A big rich guy not paying what he owes to the little guy and with his vast wealth, he steals money out of their pocket.