POLL - UConn basketball: Good for the Big East or bad

[radecicco]

People who say that UCONN will leave as soon as they can are completely out to lunch. Where are they going to go? Who wants them— they were 1-11 in football last year and won 3 games the prior two years. The fact that they are coming to the BE is because they have no place else to go— now or in the future as it relates to football. When UCONN had its chance, the B1G took Rutgers and the ACC took Louisville. No football 5 conference wants them. What’s so hard to understand about that.

Regardless of UCONN’s motivation for this move, it’s great for the BE for all the reasons listed on this board and by the experts. And it’s good for SHU unless you think we can’t compete. I’m sure not many SHU fans like UCONN, but this move enhances the league and that’s what’s important.

 

[SHUisNJsTeam]

The school already has said it won't do either.

Everyone also said they weren’t discussing conference expansion either yet here we are! Until there’s an official announcement it’s all speculation.

 

[SHUSource]

The American doesn’t look poised to make UConn work too hard to leave. They don’t really care. They are focused on growing football revenue, and UConn does absolutely nothing in that regard for them. The reason they won’t let them remain as a football-only member (like Navy) is because they are less than worthless as a program; there is zero incentive for the American to keep them on.

 

[SHUHoopsFan]

People who say that UCONN will leave as soon as they can are completely out to lunch. Where are they going to go? Who wants them— they were 1-11 in football last year and won 3 games the prior two years. The fact that they are coming to the BE is because they have no place else to go— now or in the future as it relates to football. When UCONN had its chance, the B1G took Rutgers and the ACC took Louisville. No football 5 conference wants them. What’s so hard to understand about that.

Regardless of UCONN’s motivation for this move, it’s great for the BE for all the reasons listed on this board and by the experts. And it’s good for SHU unless you think we can’t compete. I’m sure not many SHU fans like UCONN, but this move enhances the league and that’s what’s important.

Rutgers got picked up by the B1G. Why? A NY presence. If someone could prove a lot more advertising money by gaining a program in the New England region Uconn can get picked up. The B1G didn’t pick up Rutgers because they were performing at such a high level. It’s about money.

 

[radecicco]

Rutgers got picked up by the B1G. Why? A NY presence. If someone could prove a lot more advertising money by gaining a program in the New England region Uconn can get picked up. The B1G didn’t pick up Rutgers because they were performing at such a high level. It’s about money.

You’re right and the decision was that UCONN and New England can’t drive any numbers, hence Rutgers and Louisville.

 

[TheHall87]

Everyone also said they weren’t discussing conference expansion either yet here we are! Until there’s an official announcement it’s all speculation.

This deal has been basically done for months as I understand it. And it's been talked about for quite some time.

 

[hallgrad80]

People who say that UCONN will leave as soon as they can are completely out to lunch. Where are they going to go? Who wants them— they were 1-11 in football last year and won 3 games the prior two years. The fact that they are coming to the BE is because they have no place else to go— now or in the future as it relates to football. When UCONN had its chance, the B1G took Rutgers and the ACC took Louisville. No football 5 conference wants them. What’s so hard to understand about that.

Regardless of UCONN’s motivation for this move, it’s great for the BE for all the reasons listed on this board and by the experts. And it’s good for SHU unless you think we can’t compete. I’m sure not many SHU fans like UCONN, but this move enhances the league and that’s what’s important.

There’s a difference between wanting to leave and being in a position to leave because you have a better option. For UConn it’s football program has been so bad no power 5 conference has any interest in offering them an invitation to join and their football program is a millstone around their neck and the chances of that changing are almost non existent so they took a different route and it’s the non-football conference BE.

 

[mbraue]

My opinion is a little different than most. Good for big East if we have guarantees they won’t bolt or drop football but bad for seton hall.

Some here say it’s good for seton hall and I don’t see it. You have a team in UConn that historically takes top talent from the NY metro area, they are close in geography (our best recent recruit ground) they have a jersey coach who will always try to take area talent in Jersey, right now we are the best metro area team and best by far in big east. If UConn gets more nationally relevant with a move to the big east that would boost their recruiting in the area too.


I like where we are at and UConn disrupts that, they are too close to us. I’d rather add someone outside the tri-state. Right now we are the better basketball program, but if they are added I’m not sure that stays that way.

Right now we are the better program and Willard the better coach.

 

[TomD82]

Adding a school that had a 40M athletic dept. deficit and brings not much as far as ad revenue or moving rating numbers in NE. And Fox is going to pay more for this? It was a nice fresh start for and with all the schools in the new BE, but it doesn't seem like it lasted very long. As radecicco posted the B1G needed or at least felt they needed RU and Maryland for the BTN. Does the BE really need UConn?

 

[TomD82]

UConn hasn’t even been to the dance! Why so eager to have UConn be the flag bearer for the Big East when Seton Hall should be more than capable? The Big East is a much better conference than where UConn currently wallows in mediocrity.

Also, the Big East has the top conference tournament in the country and sells out MSG. I’m not quite sure what they bring to the table anymore. This is not your father’s UConn!

I’m just not getting why people are so enamored with UConn. Obviously I don’t have a vote in the matter but I just see UConn as a middling team from a mid-major conference. If they are so great then why aren’t they tearing it up in the land of misfit toys? No one in that conference wants to be there, I get that, but why are we handing out life rafts?

Has to be an inferiority complex for many. I also have no idea why the fascination with UConn even historically.

 

[SHUHoopsFan]

You’re right and the decision was that UCONN and New England can’t drive any numbers, hence Rutgers and Louisville.

LOL. As if that will be the only time conferences will look into that. Demographics change over time and if someone can prove UConn brings with it a large number of viewers they will be picked up by a power 5 program. Right now they can’t prove it. 10 years from now who knows.

Rutgers and Maryland got picked up by the big 10. Not sure what Louisville has to do with anything.

 

[Bluebeard]

That'd be a neutral site game if we opened the upper deck for UConn.

That's not even true with Nova, when they were top 5. I don't see that w Uconn. This isn't 1997.

 

[Halldan1]

This deal has been basically done for months as I understand it. And it's been talked about for quite some time.

Exactly. This was not a secret but those that knew respected the wishes of UConn and the Big East and did not leak the news. But in reality it was only going to be a matter of time before someone wanting the notoriety was going to break the story.

 

[Hall91]

Would have to imagine the biggest part of this announcement is UConn either taking their Football program independent or deciding to 1-AA/FCS or whatever you call it these days. Has huge implications for the players and coaches.

 

[SHUisNJsTeam]

That's not even true with Nova, when they were top 5. I don't see that w Uconn. This isn't 1997.

We just need to control the tickets, make sure it’s Seton Hall fans and not UConn fans getting them. Whatever we’re doing in that regard with Villanova has to be replicated here as well.

 

[SHUisNJsTeam]

Would have to imagine the biggest part of this announcement is UConn either taking their Football program independent or deciding to 1-AA/FCS or whatever you call it these days. Has huge implications for the players and coaches.

I’m thinking this decision sits a lot better with people if UConn is going FCS in football. Once bitten, twice shy on getting screwed with football.

 

[TomD82]

LOL. As if that will be the only time conferences will look into that. Demographics change over time and if someone can prove UConn brings with it a large number of viewers they will be picked up by a power 5 program. Right now they can’t prove it. 10 years from now who knows.

Rutgers and Maryland got picked up by the big 10. Not sure what Louisville has to do with anything.

Good luck with that happening in 10 years. In the age of cord cutting nobody will even be streaming UConn basketball never mind football.

 

[TomD82]

I’m thinking this decision sits a lot better with peyif UConn is going FCS in football. Once bitten, twice shy on getting screwed with football.

They must have plans to go FCS football. No way they could go independent football like UMass with the costs of their AD. Their women's basketball is losing money.

 

[TomD82]

1) FOX money is only 64% of total Big East revenues and will be a lower percentage as each year goes by.

2) Except for the first year of the new BE, the distribution of funds starts out even and is then adjusted each year based on performance. For the year ended 06/30/17, Villanova received the largest share at $4,275,530 and St. John's received the smallest share at $2,869,986.

I read the original Fox deal was 500 million for 12 years which could rise to 600 million if the league expanded to 12 teams. So another team must be on the way before the deal expires and the percentage you cited will change. The BET, T3 rights if any or whatever cannot possibly produce the increased amount of revenues the Fox deal can.

P.S. SPK is it accurate that ACC teams do not have T3 rights with ESPN? Thanks.

 

[TheHall87]

They must have plans to go FCS football. No way they could go independent football like UMass with the costs of their AD. Their women's basketball is losing money.

I suspect their bottom line will be helped by the fact that they'll no longer be in a league with USF, UCF, Tulane, Houston, SMU, Tulsa, Wichita State and East Carolina. You do realize the second closest full member in the AAC is Cincinnati and the third is ECU, right? They've got to be getting killed on travel costs. Especially since it's not a Power Five league.

UConn is the only school in the league that competes in all 10 Men's Sports and one of two along with ECU that competes in 11 of the 12 Women's Sports that the league offers. Plus they compete in Men's and Women's Hockey and Field Hockey

 

[MTOleBlue]

We just need to control the tickets, make sure it’s Seton Hall fans and not UConn fans getting them. Whatever we’re doing in that regard with Villanova has to be replicated here as well.

Let’s not forget we had almost 17k this past year for Villanova and Pirate fans were the vast majority. The fan base is building up and if our season goes the way we are hoping next year then we may be able to snag even more season tickets and get that upper deck filling up with SHU

 

[TomD82]

I suspect their bottom line will be helped by the fact that they'll no longer be in a league with USF, UCF, Tulane, Houston, SMU, Tulsa, Wichita State and East Carolina. You do realize the second closest full member in the AAC is Cincinnati and the third is ECU, right? They've got to be getting killed on travel costs. Especially since it's not a Power Five league.

UConn is the only school in the league that competes in all 10 Men's Sports and one of two along with ECU that competes in 11 of the 12 Women's Sports that the league offers. Plus they compete in Men's and Women's Hockey and Field Hockey

Which is why I don't think they could go independent with football. There is no demand for their football media rights and the costs would be similar to what you described if they were independent for football. They have to be going FCS with a geographic fit.

 

[Halldan1]

 

[Halldan1]

 

[TomD82]

JP in his November 2018 Forbes article didn't see any problems with the conference either. If this were a business acquisition in would all be goodwill. Connecticut does not bring much IMO. But, if it does result in a 10M entrance fee, up to a 20% increase in the original Fox deal and offset to the costs of the BET which Ackerman has already said is a high cost event and just got higher in the new MSG that is what it is all about.

UConn made the NCAA 2 of the last 6 years I think and was banned one year. Hardly the NCAA run except for that magical year with Ollie that Dan mentioned as lacking from current teams beside Nova.

 

[HallLine69]

Definitely good for the league to have a program with such a rich tradition and track record back in the fold.

I don't like UConn and I strongly dislike much of their fan base. But that's irrelevant. They are unquestionably an asset to the league and I love that they are back.

 

[Halldan1]

UConn made the NCAA 2 of the last 6 years I think and was banned one year. Hardly the NCAA run except for that magical year with Ollie that Dan mentioned as lacking from current teams beside Nova.

We're not talking about the recent past, we're projecting into the future. Hurley has been at UConn for one year now and he already has a top 20 recruiting class coming in this season.

That bodes well for the future and even more so when you take into consideration the move to the Big East.

I understand those that don't want to see this happen. I strongly disagree with their thinking but they have every right to voice their concern and down the road we'll see who was right and who was wrong.

 

[SHUisNJsTeam]

Let’s not forget we had almost 17k this past year for Villanova and Pirate fans were the vast majority. The fan base is building up and if our season goes the way we are hoping next year then we may be able to snag even more season tickets and get that upper deck filling up with SHU

Speaking of season tickets, I would love to know where we currently stand with those, especially after Myles announced he was coming back and with all of the excitement and expectations surrounding the team this coming season!

 

[SHUisNJsTeam]

We're not talking about the recent past, we're projecting into the future. Hurley has been at UConn for one year now and he already has a top 20 recruiting class coming in this season.

That bodes well for the future and even more so when you take into consideration the move to the Big East.

I understand those that don't want to see this happen. I strongly disagree with their thinking but they have every right to voice their concern and down the road we'll see who was right and who was wrong.

I’m sure Hurley knew of the potential move to the Big East and used that in his recruiting of the current class. Why else would anyone want to go up to the cow country that is MooConn?

 

[lloyde dobler]

LOL. As if that will be the only time conferences will look into that. Demographics change over time and if someone can prove UConn brings with it a large number of viewers they will be picked up by a power 5 program. Right now they can’t prove it. 10 years from now who knows.

Rutgers and Maryland got picked up by the big 10. Not sure what Louisville has to do with anything.

Can you be any more off base?

Demographics in the Northeast aren’t getting any better. People are leaving and that’s not going to suddenly change in the next 10 years. And that’s without thinking about cord cutting among those who stay.

No one thinks UConn football is strong enough to bring into their conference. That’s why programs like Clemson and Florida State were adamant about it before... and that was five years ago when UConn football was even better than they are now.

Louisville was mentioned because the quality of their overall athletic program, especially when this realignment stuff went down with Jurich still the king, was a LOT stronger than UConn. Louisville was perceived by the ACC schools as better and stronger.

 

[TomD82]

We're not talking about the recent past, we're projecting into the future. Hurley has been at UConn for one year now and he already has a top 20 recruiting class coming in this season.

That bodes well for the future and even more so when you take into consideration the move to the Big East.

I understand those that don't want to see this happen. I strongly disagree with their thinking but they have every right to voice their concern and down the road we'll see who was right and who was wrong.[/QUOTE

A reduction in distribution of fees from Fox, if accurate and credits to be shared among more would be a net negative.That would be classic bad business acquisition.

You are putting a lot of assumptions in Hurley and you could have assumed the same about Ollie coming off a great year. A lot has changed since 2013 and it will indeed remain to be seen how it all shakes out especially for FOX. Disney could not even sell some of the RSN they got from Fox and the Yankees had to buy back YES. And Disney ESPN seems they could care less about losing UConn. Nothing tangible from UConn right now is something we do seem to agree on.

 

[Joe_T]

We're not talking about the recent past, we're projecting into the future. Hurley has been at UConn for one year now and he already has a top 20 recruiting class coming in this season.

When I see Abdur-Rahim no longer interested in SHU but interested in UConn, I wonder if Hurley revealed to him that they'd be going to the BE.

Either way, they'll be a formidable recruiting opponent. Except for this thought, that a top 20 haul without the BE affiliation projects to even better recruiting classes to come now that they're in the BE, so it's possible UConn will be recruiting a different (more elite) class of talent than SHU normally recruits. Just like Villanova today.

 

[papacheesy2]

JP in his November 2018 Forbes article didn't see any problems with the conference either. If this were a business acquisition in would all be goodwill. Connecticut does not bring much IMO. But, if it does result in a 10M entrance fee, up to a 20% increase in the original Fox deal and offset to the costs of the BET which Ackerman has already said is a high cost event and just got higher in the new MSG that is what it is all about.

UConn made the NCAA 2 of the last 6 years I think and was banned one year. Hardly the NCAA run except for that magical year with Ollie that Dan mentioned as lacking from current teams beside Nova.

LOL they won the national championship in 2004, 2011 and 2014! Do you really think they're going to be bottom-feeders forever now because they've had three recent losing seasons? Of COURSE UConn is going to come back to prominence and it's great that it's going to happen in our conference. Sheesh.

 

[lloyde dobler]

When I see Abdur-Rahim no longer interested in SHU but interested in UConn, I wonder if Hurley revealed to him that they'd be going to the BE.

Either way, they'll be a formidable recruiting opponent. Except for this thought, that a top 20 haul without the BE affiliation projects to even better recruiting classes to come now that they're in the BE, so it's possible UConn will be recruiting a different (more elite) class of talent than SHU normally recruits. Just like Villanova today.

They still have to win first. And again, it’s not like the Hurley’s are some unstoppable force. They have plenty of people who dislike them on the circuit.

 

[seton1996]

I think a lot of the people that are against this move seem to be influenced some by two factors that really should not come into play when deciding if this is good or not for the BE: one seems to be the general dislike of the UConn athletic department by other schools fans and the second the bad taste left in our mouth watching the old BE collapse due to football schools leaving.

 

[SPK145]

A reduction in distribution of fees from Fox, if accurate and credits to be shared among more would be a net negative.That would be classic bad business acquisition.

Nobody ever said there was a reduction in distribution of fees from Fox, they go up slightly every year, but the percent of the total revenues from them goes down every year because, you guessed it (well YOU probably didn't guess it), the NCAA credits go up significantly each year.

Adding UCONN and Increasing membership by 10% means everyone could take a small haircut in the short-term (probably not, see below) but the long-term consequences of adding UCONN far out weigh that.

I believe the Fox rights would increase right away by adding UCONN and UCONN will probably not get an equal cut of other revenues right away. This could be one way of how their entrance fees are effectively paid as they will have to also pay exit fees to the AAC.

 

[SHUSource]

We're not talking about the recent past, we're projecting into the future. Hurley has been at UConn for one year now and he already has a top 20 recruiting class coming in this season.

That bodes well for the future and even more so when you take into consideration the move to the Big East.

This. And I don’t see why it is so hard for people to understand.

UConn is going to be very good, very quickly. And that’s good. Yeah, it definitely makes things tougher for Seton Hall, but we’re pretty good now, too, and I embrace the challenge. The bottom line is that the league needs a program like this. The Big East is legit already, but there are some holes in its profile — the lack of postseason success by teams not located on the Main Line is one if them. UConn strengthens the brand, the league’s depth, and adds a marquee coach to the fold, a guy whose home base is right in the heart of Big East country. The pool just got deeper, but that’s a good thing. We needed it.

Also, just from the business standpoint: This puts MSG — perhaps the league’s signature asset — on lockdown forever. There is no way in hell any of these midwestern or Tobacco Road dreamers are getting in there now, unless the want to play during MAAC Tournament week again.

That’s huge. You can already see how jealous Boeheim is, no matter what league he’s in. He gets it.

 

[SPK145]

I read the original Fox deal was 500 million for 12 years

Hmm, that equates to an average of $41,666,667 per year yet the most the Big East has been paid so far for media rights in a year is $35,000,000. What is wrong with this picture?

P.S. SPK is it accurate that ACC teams do not have T3 rights with ESPN? Thanks.

They do not, they are reserved for Raycom and the new ACC Network.

 

[TomD82]

Nobody ever said there was a reduction in distribution of fees from Fox, they go up slightly every year, but the percent of the total revenues from them goes down every year because, you guessed it (well YOU probably didn't guess it), the NCAA credits go up significantly each year.

Adding UCONN and Increasing membership by 10% means everyone could take a small haircut in the short-term (probably not, see below) but the long-term consequences of adding UCONN far out weigh that.

I believe the Fox rights would increase right away by adding UCONN and UCONN will probably not get an equal cut of other revenues right away. This could be one way of how their entrance fees are effectively paid as they will have to also pay exit fees to the AAC.

Yes, the 2 championship runs by Villanova earning the max credits and the one year when like 7 teams made the NCAA earning a credit all paid out over 6 years. Surprised that the Fox percentage would go down each year so much especially when each credit is only worth like 265k a year and really no team has had a big run except Nova. I guess the conference accrues it the year earned.

What I can't guess is how Fox seems to be immune from what has been plaguing ESPN and other cable operators and now satellite. DirectTV is worth nothing close to what AT&T paid for it. So this niche programming for FOX albeit not huge money in the scheme of things is working for them.

 

[STLPirate12]

The Big East in no way needed to UConn - we have been and would continue to be more than fine without them. If anything, it was UConn who needed the Big East. That doesn't mean they aren't helpful though. It's a major basketball brand with a strong reputation and they will bring more attention to the Big East. For the league, I see nothing negative.