United we don’t stand

[HallBall02]

Judge asked for formal response by 3:00. We'll know soon enough if Trump was bluffing, but worth noting that he has the warrant and is free to release it on his own if he wanted to.

Haha, these people let the propaganda seep into their veins so quickly.

The outrage that Trump created by demanding the FBI release the contents of the warrant when he could have done it at anytime is a perfect example. Tell a lie enough they will believe it I guess…

 

[Merge]

I thought you were going to wait to get facts

The facts are that a grand jury subpoena was issued in June. The DOJ had evidence to support that Trump was not complying with the subpoena and a judge signed off on a warrant to obtain the rest of the documents.

 

[PiratePride]

Good about not wanting Trump to run. Why don’t you want him to run again?

it’s funny, it’s okay that you can talk about Trump when using the trump raid as further evidence that FBI is corrupt but I can’t say that Trump is a habitual liar and that we should trust the FBI/DOJ more in this matter over the lies trump tells you?

I don’t understand your logic either my man.

Let me give you an example of logic. I don't want to repeat myself here, since I have pointed out in this thread a number of instances some where the FBI /DOJ have abused their power and broken the law in trying to stop Trump. A definite pattern has been established. A logical person would therefore have some doubts about their veracity as it pertains to Trump.

I use FBI and DOJ not to discredit every member of those organizations; I am accusing only those at the top and who are in some form of management who are directing the abusive activities.

The warrant and raid on his property will energize Trump and his base and may be the deciding factor in whether he runs or not. While there are parts of his personality that I dislike and I prefer that he not be the candidate, I would not hesitate to vote for him if he runs and is nominated.

Actually, I am in a win-win situation here. If Trump is guilty as charged (whatever that is), I would get my wish since that would likely derail any hopes he had of running again. Then it's DeSantis (IMO) and I'm a happy camper. If there is "no there there".... then my sense of logic is validated.... and I still get to vote against the Democrat Socialists who are running the current administration.

 

[PiratePride]

I'm not convinced of anything yet.

I want all of the info out. Warrant, affidavit etc...

fair enough..... you sounded pretty sure, stating it emphatically in at least one of your posts I remember reading.... jes sayin

 

[PiratePride]

Judge asked for formal response by 3:00. We'll know soon enough if Trump was bluffing, but worth noting that he has the warrant and is free to release it on his own if he wanted to.

I would guess that if left to his own choice, he would want the affidavit before releasing it.

 

[HallBall02]

yes you would. And you would be in jail long time for 90% of what the political elite and rich donors get away with yet in the next sentence you’ll tell me how can I not trust the FBI and DOJ when clearly as you eloquently point out they have different rules for different folks. You and I would have much different results. Glad you trust the people who would lock you up and throw away the key and let others go for the same thing.

I agree.

But with trump and his power over GOP, and influence over a large portion of government and population…you need to get all your ducks in a row with enough iron clad evidence before doing something like a raid which takes time.

Me and you they could prob just take the word of one witness and then throw the book at us. With Trump and his power, it may not be enough.

 

[HallBall02]

Let me give you an example of logic. I don't want to repeat myself here, since I have pointed out in this thread a number of instances some where the FBI /DOJ have abused their power and broken the law in trying to stop Trump. A definite pattern has been established. A logical person would therefore have some doubts about their veracity as it pertains to Trump.

I use FBI and DOJ not to discredit every member of those organizations; I am accusing only those at the top and who are in some form of management who are directing the abusive activities.

The warrant and raid on his property will energize Trump and his base and may be the deciding factor in whether he runs or not. While there are parts of his personality that I dislike and I prefer that he not be the candidate, I would not hesitate to vote for him if he runs and is nominated.

Actually, I am in a win-win situation here. If Trump is guilty as charged (whatever that is), I would get my wish since that would likely derail any hopes he had of running again. Then it's DeSantis (IMO) and I'm a happy camper. If there is "no there there".... then my sense of logic is validated.... and I still get to vote against the Democrat Socialists who are running the current administration.

The 2nd part is logical, with your win win scenario. Trump guilty then preferred candidate Desantis if not, empowers base for his re-election and proves your point FBI leadership corrupt.

The first part is not, the leadership at the FBI that you say is corrupt is championed by the FBI director Christopher Wray appointed by Trump himself. Also much of what you say about the FBI abusing power in the past to get Trump is not entirely based on fact and under different FBI leadership, Comey.

My thoughts, if not for being a sitting president and a scope more broad to actually prosecute him, he would be found guilty with the Russia collusion case. So I don’t think they are out to get him as much as following the laws and safeguarding our presidential elections from foreign powers.

I’ll admit it was a mistake for the Mueller investigation to go down this rabbit hole bc even if he found something so incriminating, the scope was too narrow and couldn’t prosecute a sitting president allowing Trump now to say he was innocent and it was a witch hunt which neither is correct.

 

[Merge]

fair enough..... you sounded pretty sure, stating it emphatically in at least one of your posts I remember reading.... jes sayin

Where I will go out on a limb is saying that I don't believe Garland does this unless he absolutely has to.

I think he understands the optics in this environment.. so I'm just empathically saying that the people who are convinced that Trump is being treated unfairly at this point are crazy.

 

[PiratePride]

Where I will go out on a limb is saying that I don't believe Garland does this unless he absolutely has to.

I think he understands the optics in this environment.. so I'm just empathically saying that the people who are convinced that Trump is being treated unfairly at this point are crazy.

Well, Garland is the guy who sic'd the FBI on school parents at school board meetings. I wouldn't be so sure of his bone fides when it comes to making the right call. And the disinformation board that got canned.... now that was a doozy.

So you are convicned that Trump is being treated fairly based on ... what?

 

[Seton75]

The Teflon Don...

lofl

 

[PiratePride]

The 2nd part is logical, with your win win scenario. Trump guilty then preferred candidate Desantis if not, empowers base for his re-election and proves your point FBI leadership corrupt.

The first part is not, the leadership at the FBI that you say is corrupt is championed by the FBI director Christopher Wray appointed by Trump himself. Also much of what you say about the FBI abusing power in the past to get Trump is not entirely based on fact and under different FBI leadership, Comey.

My thoughts, if not for being a sitting president and a scope more broad to actually prosecute him, he would be found guilty with the Russia collusion case. So I don’t think they are out to get him as much as following the laws and safeguarding our presidential elections from foreign powers.

I’ll admit it was a mistake for the Mueller investigation to go down this rabbit hole bc even if he found something so incriminating, the scope was too narrow and couldn’t prosecute a sitting president allowing Trump now to say he was innocent and it was a witch hunt which neither is correct.

While Wray was appointed by Trump proves nothing except that maybe Trump wasn't aware how deep the deep state really is. The FBI was found guilty of lieing on the FISA warrants.... they have sat on the Biden laptop since dec of 2019... recently multiple FBI whistleblowers have stated that information was purposely withheld about the laptop and a claim was made that the Steele Dossier was promoted as valid even though they were aware that it it was not verifiable. They do not have a good record here.

Russia collusion was totally debunked. I suppose you are still waiting for Adam Schiff to finally release the evidence he stated over and over again that he had about Trump's collusion with Russia. If you believe that you probably also believe Jerry Nadler when he said that Antifa is a myth.

 

[Merge]

Well, Garland is the guy who sic'd the FBI on school parents at school board meetings.

No he didn't.

https://www.justice.gov/ag/page/file/1438986/download

He just said they take threats against school officials seriously committed to using DOJ authority and resources to discourage the threats.

So you are convicned that Trump is being treated fairly based on ... what?

Nothing to suggest that he isn't.
After a subpoena was issued, boxes marked as classified, secret and top secret were taken. He had two months to comply with a subpoena and didn't. When you don't comply, they get a warrant. That seems fair to me.

 

[HallBall02]

While Wray was appointed by Trump proves nothing except that maybe Trump wasn't aware how deep the deep state really is. The FBI was found guilty of lieing on the FISA warrants.... they have sat on the Biden laptop since dec of 2019... recently multiple FBI whistleblowers have stated that information was purposely withheld about the laptop and a claim was made that the Steele Dossier was promoted as valid even though they were aware that it it was not verifiable. They do not have a good record here.

Russia collusion was totally debunked. I suppose you are still waiting for Adam Schiff to finally release the evidence he stated over and over again that he had about Trump's collusion with Russia. If you believe that you probably also believe Jerry Nadler when he said that Antifa is a myth.

Wow, ok so it’s not the FBI leadership but it’s the whole system that is corrupt. Got it.

To me, instead of saying everyone but Trump is corrupt, it seems more likely, and reasonable, that Trump is corrupt and the FBI has been smeared by him and his cronies for years now with constant propaganda that eventually worked on you to actually believe Trump over the FBI, though in the same token most here will admit Trump constantly lies.

 

[PiratePride]

Wow, ok so it’s not the FBI leadership but it’s the whole system that is corrupt. Got it.

To me, instead of saying everyone but Trump is corrupt, it seems more likely, and reasonable, that Trump is corrupt and the FBI has been smeared by him and his cronies for years now with constant propaganda that eventually worked on you to actually believe Trump over the FBI, though in the same token most here will admit Trump constantly lies.

Fuggeduboudit... You keep putting words in my mouth. Have good weekend.

 

[PiratePride]

No he didn't.

https://www.justice.gov/ag/page/file/1438986/download

He just said they take threats against school officials seriously committed to using DOJ authority and resources to discourage the threats.



Nothing to suggest that he isn't.
After a subpoena was issued, boxes marked as classified, secret and top secret were taken. He had two months to comply with a subpoena and didn't. When you don't comply, they get a warrant. That seems fair to me.

You can wordsmith it any way you want.... fact is parents were targeted based on his direction.

You can justify the warrant if you want to..... there were other ways to handle this, though.... hopefully, the affidavit will be made public so we can all see for ourselves what this was all about.

 

[Merge]

You can wordsmith it any way you want.... fact is parents were targeted based on his direction.

I linked the actual order. Concerned parents were not targeted.
They didn't target anyone. They didn't send any federal officials to school board meetings. All he said was that they would work with local law enforcement to discourage threats against public officials.

You can justify the warrant if you want to..... there were other ways to handle this, though....

The subpoena was issued in June. Trump still had materials marked as top secret in August. What other way are are you talking about here?

 

[HallBall02]

Fuggeduboudit... You keep putting words in my mouth. Have good weekend.

🤔, you believe trump over the FBI bc it’s a deep state and the whole FBI system is corrupt. No I got it!

Have good wkd as well!

 

[PiratePride]

🤔, you believe trump over the FBI bc it’s a deep state and the whole FBI system is corrupt. No I got it!

Have good wkd as well!

whatever you say

 

[cernjSHU]

While Wray was appointed by Trump proves nothing except that maybe Trump wasn't aware how deep the deep state really is. The FBI was found guilty of lieing on the FISA warrants.... they have sat on the Biden laptop since dec of 2019... recently multiple FBI whistleblowers have stated that information was purposely withheld about the laptop and a claim was made that the Steele Dossier was promoted as valid even though they were aware that it it was not verifiable. They do not have a good record here.

Russia collusion was totally debunked. I suppose you are still waiting for Adam Schiff to finally release the evidence he stated over and over again that he had about Trump's collusion with Russia. If you believe that you probably also believe Jerry Nadler when he said that Antifa is a myth.

PirateOrode revéala himself as a conspiracist Talking about the Deep Stare. No need to engage with a person like you. You a full member of the cult.

 

[PiratePride]

PirateOrode revéala himself as a conspiracist Talking about the Deep Stare. No need to engage with a person like you. You a full member of the cult.

look in the mirror.... there you will find a cultist..... may not see him at first, may have head in sand....

 

[SHUHoopsFan]

I agree.

But with trump and his power over GOP, and influence over a large portion of government and population…you need to get all your ducks in a row with enough iron clad evidence before doing something like a raid which takes time.

Me and you they could prob just take the word of one witness and then throw the book at us. With Trump and his power, it may not be enough.

ok based on everything you just said, the FBI and the DOJ would treat you and me different than Trump. That’s not exactly following the rule of law. Not sure why you have so much trust in the FBI and DOJ. They’re not exactly the saints in a room going after a sinner. This is corrupt on corrupt. Let’s see if you can return serve and answer the question without deflection, why would you have so much trust in a department that would lock you up and throw away the key and would let others go for the same crime?

 

[HallBall02]

 

[HallBall02]

 

[HallBall02]

ok based on everything you just said, the FBI and the DOJ would treat you and me different than Trump. That’s not exactly following the rule of law. Not sure why you have so much trust in the FBI and DOJ. They’re not exactly the saints in a room going after a sinner. This is corrupt on corrupt. Let’s see if you can return serve and answer the question without deflection, why would you have so much trust in a department that would lock you up and throw away the key and would let others go for the same crime?

I don’t know how your point is relevant, no one is above the law.

But preparation and when they choose to enforce the law to a former president and potential future president candidate, might be different. They probably want to dot all the i’s and cross all the t’s to make sure everything is done right.

i hate to admit it but Trump is very good at (which may be a surprise to some) using misinformation and propaganda with his base and cronies to make them believe in his lies, he also has a very long career taking advantage of laws with loopholes and other underhanded tactics with his lawyers in business and politics.

 

[HallBall02]

 

[HallBall02]

 

[HallBall02]

 

[HallBall02]

Shocking they cancelled it.

 

[HallBall02]

 

[SHUSA]

the trump freaks have stockholm syndrome. simply cant come to terms with being so wrong. gotta keep doubling down no matter how clear it becomes.

 

[SHUHoopsFan]

I don’t know how your point is relevant, no one is above the law.

But preparation and when they choose to enforce the law to a former president and potential future president candidate, might be different. They probably want to dot all the i’s and cross all the t’s to make sure everything is done right.

i hate to admit it but Trump is very good at (which may be a surprise to some) using misinformation and propaganda with his base and cronies to make them believe in his lies, he also has a very long career taking advantage of laws with loopholes and other underhanded tactics with his lawyers in business and politics.

you deflected and didn’t answer the simple question. Yes nobody is above the law except the law applies different for me and you than it does the elite. So I’ll ask again. Maybe this time you’ll just be a stand up, straight forward individual and answer the frigging question. How can you trust the people who you admit would put you in jail and throw away the key while letting others go for the same crime?

 

[HallBall02]

you deflected and didn’t answer the simple question. Yes nobody is above the law except the law applies different for me and you than it does the elite. So I’ll ask again. Maybe this time you’ll just be a stand up, straight forward individual and answer the frigging question. How can you trust the people who you admit would put you in jail and throw away the key while letting others go for the same crime?

Umm when did I admit that?

I was explaining why they might lock us up right away without much prep and why they may take their time with Trump. Not that trump or you should or would get away with it.

 

[HallBall02]

look in the mirror.... there you will find a cultist..... may not see him at first, may have head in sand....

 

[SHUHoopsFan]

Umm when did I admit that?

I was explaining why they might lock us up right away without much prep and why they may take their time with Trump. Not that trump or you should or would get away with it.

Stop playing games. You won’t answer the question.

Yes, Don is being treated differently (better) by FBI bc he is the former president.

For every other American, the FBI would not have waited a year and been so kind in search and reclaiming classified material.

someone must have hacked your account and posted this. Contact rivals. You know damn well these departments treat different people better than others. You said so yourself

 

[HallBall02]

Stop playing games. You won’t answer the question.

someone must have hacked your account and posted this. Contact rivals. You know damn well these departments treat different people better than others. You said so yourself

Umm. Still not following.

He is being treated better bc the FBI and Trump were in negotiations for a few months to get classified docs back.

For you and me, non former presidents, if we took classified info away from a secure facility we would be immediately locked up. What are you not following?

 

[SHUHoopsFan]

Umm. Still not following.

He is being treated better bc the FBI and Trump were in negotiations for a few months to get classified docs back.

For you and me, non former presidents, if we took classified info away from a secure facility we would be immediately locked up. What are you not following?

The laws should apply the same for all people. Either he should be locked up right away or we all should be allowed negotiations. Elites get better treatment. That’s not their job. They’re not following their duties by handling things differently. you trust these people to do the right thing, yet God forbid you got caught up in something, even accidentally, the matter would be over and done for you in seconds. You’d be the first one sitting there wonder why any elite gets better treatment than you did.

 

[HallBall02]

The laws should apply the same for all people. Either he should be locked up right away or we all should be allowed negotiations. Elites get better treatment. That’s not their job. They’re not following their duties by handling things differently. you trust these people to do the right thing, yet God forbid you got caught up in something, even accidentally, the matter would be over and done for you in seconds. You’d be the first one sitting there wonder why any elite gets better treatment than you did.

Well I’m all for making it stricter for former presidents. The rule should be that after their last day in office they can no longer take/view secure docs at all after our experience with former president Trump.

Crazy to think, of all the other former presidents in my lifetime, i wouldnt think twice about them being a national security risk because I knew they loved their country more than their own personal enrichments. Certainly not the same with Trump.

Hope someone passes that law and makes it a more strict timetable with the potential of a future trump like guy or worse president elected to office down the road.

Allowing time to settle up seems to be a normal former president practice, such as the Clinton furniture thing, but yes it does seems like former presidents get preferential treatment without knowing the actual rules involved.

Ultimately, the fact the FBI/DOJ waited hopefully didn’t put our country at risk, I still have faith in the FBI to be fair and enforce laws. I admit, no agency is perfect, no business, person, org is, every org has some flaws in their past, but I trust them 100% over a person like Trump.

In this case, giving a former president time to do the right thing (as they have done with every other former president) seems reasonable in a vacuum and as far as I know, not against the law (I don’t think). When Trump didn’t comply, then build up a case against him and secure the docs seemed like the right move. It took two months to make that move, which again, they needed to do everything right or face severe scrutiny, hell they probably did everything right and they are still getting death threats and being attacked by the crazies.

 

[SHUSA]

Well I’m all for making it stricter for former presidents. The rule should be that after their last day in office they can no longer take/view secure docs at all after our experience with former president Trump.

Crazy to think, of all the other former presidents in my lifetime, i wouldnt think twice about them being a national security risk because I knew they loved their country more than their own personal enrichments. Certainly not the same with Trump.

Hope someone passes that law and makes it a more strict timetable with the potential of a future trump like guy or worse president elected to office down the road.

Allowing time to settle up seems to be a normal former president practice, such as the Clinton furniture thing, but yes it does seems like former presidents get preferential treatment without knowing the actual rules involved.

Ultimately, the fact the FBI/DOJ waited hopefully didn’t put our country at risk, I still have faith in the FBI to be fair and enforce laws. I admit, no agency is perfect, no business, person, org is, every org has some flaws in their past, but I trust them 100% over a person like Trump.

In this case, giving a former president time to do the right thing (as they have done with every other former president) seems reasonable in a vacuum and as far as I know, not against the law (I don’t think). When Trump didn’t comply, then build up a case against him and secure the docs seemed like the right move. It took two months to make that move, which again, they needed to do everything right or face severe scrutiny, hell they probably did everything right and they are still getting death threats and being attacked by the crazies.

trump literally signed a law about stricter penalties for this sort of thing LOL

 

[SHUHoopsFan]

Well I’m all for making it stricter for former presidents. The rule should be that after their last day in office they can no longer take/view secure docs at all after our experience with former president Trump.

Crazy to think, of all the other former presidents in my lifetime, i wouldnt think twice about them being a national security risk because I knew they loved their country more than their own personal enrichments. Certainly not the same with Trump.

Hope someone passes that law and makes it a more strict timetable with the potential of a future trump like guy or worse president elected to office down the road.

Allowing time to settle up seems to be a normal former president practice, such as the Clinton furniture thing, but yes it does seems like former presidents get preferential treatment without knowing the actual rules involved.

Ultimately, the fact the FBI/DOJ waited hopefully didn’t put our country at risk, I still have faith in the FBI to be fair and enforce laws. I admit, no agency is perfect, no business, person, org is, every org has some flaws in their past, but I trust them 100% over a person like Trump.

In this case, giving a former president time to do the right thing (as they have done with every other former president) seems reasonable in a vacuum and as far as I know, not against the law (I don’t think). When Trump didn’t comply, then build up a case against him and secure the docs seemed like the right move. It took two months to make that move, which again, they needed to do everything right or face severe scrutiny, hell they probably did everything right and they are still getting death threats and being attacked by the crazies.

If he’s got stuff for 20 months with nuclear classified info then we should know why and how they let that happen and why they went in 3 days after they got the warrant. Great comment hopefully the DOJ/FBI didn’t put our country at risk by waiting. Either they put us at risk or Trump doesn’t have the stuff they think he has. Either way not a good look for them.

 

[anon_ezos2e9wn1ob0]

Awfully quiet on here from certain people after the receipts got dropped.

If he’s got stuff for 20 months with nuclear classified info then we should know why and how they let that happen and why they went in 3 days after they got the warrant. Great comment hopefully the DOJ/FBI didn’t put our country at risk by waiting. Either they put us at risk or Trump doesn’t have the stuff they think he has. Either way not a good look for them.

Here we go, now they didnt do it soon enough. Always something.